Posted on Aug 1, 2016
Why do you think women are not going to Combat Arms MOS's?
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So now the SMA is asking for more women to step up and join combat arms. In this article the Army opened up 220,000 jobs for women. These must have been all the Combat Arms jobs in the Army but so far they have about 100 volunteers. It isn't looking too good for diversity. So much for fighting to open the flood gates. I think a garden hose would have sufficed.
I myself could think of a few reasons that those women in the military see and understand that these new soldiers coming into combat arms really don't. These new soldier don't really know or understand what they are getting into but then who really does. If you were to think about just the infantry you really don't need to look further than Ranger School and it's relation to promotion. Look at just about all of the leadership in the Infantry and you will see they are Tabbed. I can't really recall seeing any CSMs without one. So when they compete up against these guys for an SFC slot that are tabbed who do you think that is going to selected for promotion and good assignments?
In addition, I have seen what infantry go through in the field. Ask any OIF I vet about taking a shower. It was a luxury. Ask a Dog Faced soldier from the 3rd ID. We lived in our tracks in the dessert only to charge into Iraq to not take a shower for weeks. Do you think any of this could be affecting their decision?
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/2016/08/01/sma-army-needs-female-soldiers-step-up-combat-jobs/87931290/
I myself could think of a few reasons that those women in the military see and understand that these new soldiers coming into combat arms really don't. These new soldier don't really know or understand what they are getting into but then who really does. If you were to think about just the infantry you really don't need to look further than Ranger School and it's relation to promotion. Look at just about all of the leadership in the Infantry and you will see they are Tabbed. I can't really recall seeing any CSMs without one. So when they compete up against these guys for an SFC slot that are tabbed who do you think that is going to selected for promotion and good assignments?
In addition, I have seen what infantry go through in the field. Ask any OIF I vet about taking a shower. It was a luxury. Ask a Dog Faced soldier from the 3rd ID. We lived in our tracks in the dessert only to charge into Iraq to not take a shower for weeks. Do you think any of this could be affecting their decision?
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/2016/08/01/sma-army-needs-female-soldiers-step-up-combat-jobs/87931290/
Combat Arms
Women in the Military
Soldiers
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 25
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As a woman and currently serving service member, I have seen the toll a combat arms job can take on a man (I work as part of the legal counsel for MEBs) and I wouldn't wish it on them and cannot see myself as a woman doing the things they do. I'm all for those females who are fit and have the mindset that this is what they desire. I agree with CPT Pitre that women are not flooding the gates to get these jobs and I don't think that'll change in the near future. The purpose was to break the barrier... Not to recruit a specific percentage of women... Or was it? Like I said I am all for those that CAN and are welcome to it.
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Capt Tom Brown
Well said CW2 (Join to see) The time had come to break the barrier as you say The people pushing this in upper levels of gvt and DOD may be a little surprised at the number of women who do not rush to fill the slots.
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CPT Russell Pitre
"The purpose was to break the barrier... Not to recruit a specific percentage of women... Or was it? "
That's the million dollar question.
That's the million dollar question.
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Because they don't WANT to. Plain and simple. When I joined, I WANTED a specific job. I wanted to be a vet tech and I refused to sign a contract until I got that job.
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CPT Russell Pitre
Thanks for being honest. I just wonder if the Army thought it would have had more interest.
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Same reason that not every guy that joins the army is 11B. If you take all the men in the Army how small is the percentage that is 11B. You hear a lot of comments from different people about women in combat arms jobs. The only people that should be commenting are the ones in Combat Arms. It is amazing how many people have an opinion that have never done the job.
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I think you will see women going into Combat Arms but it won't be at the rate that the ashwipes at the pentagon thought it would be. Like some members have stated here I think this was a behind the scenes ploy of a few people that had the same agenda and wanted to see how far it would go and what kind of controversy they could stir up.
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The fact that so few women are volunteering for combat arms will simply be the launching pad for the next attack which will be that there is so much organizational bias in the armed forces women just are not comfortable applying. This will end up being the men's fault. We will need to have combat arms sensitivity training for men, then a few standards lowered to entice more to try.
The pushers of women in combat arms will never consider that there may simply not be enough women that have any desire to do it.
The pushers of women in combat arms will never consider that there may simply not be enough women that have any desire to do it.
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I was an MP and being around women was normal. I went to Armor where the only female was the occasional medic These Armor guys could talk frankly, make lewd jokes and not have to worry about EEOC/sharp complaints. Women don't want to worry about any of that crap and yeast infections if they are in another Desert Shield situation where they were out there for over a month or two with no shower and wearing the same stinky clothes for that whole time and nothing but a few changes of underwear.
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LTC Stephen Conway
SFC Lauren Orrok - Thansk for the compliment. I just was thinking what I saw the attitude in one unit vs another circa 1996-2003. I am not a misogynist LOL like maybe some men here may be or have been since I had a female drill sergeant among the male ones, a command Sergeant major in basic who was originally from one of the last class of the WACS. I have had them as platoon sergeants, platoon leaders and company commanders. I just think that if a woman does rough it she needs to have her hygiene.
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Because war and fighting are a male thing. Even in the animal world it is the males who stake out territory and fight off other males and animals of the same type. The female do hunt , but for food, the male fight for territory and power. Even in hive behavior it is male drones that fight. Humans being a cooperative animal it is the males who fight in groups against other males. Anyone who think women should be in combats is going PC and PC is against the laws of nature itself. It should be no wonder why female humans do not want to be in the combat arms. It is simple an aberration of nature when it occurs or is forced to occur.
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SPC Christopher Perrien
LOL, Yes it is. Thank You. :)
Just so you know SFC , I was in the combat arms, TANKS. Very HE-Man stuff there even without being in a big war. :) . But really there are not a lot of women in the Army (15%or so) and the combat arms are the smallest part of the Army about 15% too I guess, And tanks are the smallest branch of the combat arms. IIRC. SO just by the numbers there will hardly ever be any multiple numbers of females being on tanks. And if such a tiny % was accommodated, it would be at a cost that far outweighs any benefit, besides causing a lot of problems the Tank Corps does not need. And to tell the truth, even the most Butch, capable, female mechanics I met in the Army, could not have hacked it on tanks. If it is tried , the costs I know will be extreme. I think it would cause a sexual harassment nightmare leading not just to ruined careers and bad unit performance, but also running off many of the capable male tankers , who will always be 98-99% of the soldiers in Armor even with the most radical PC agenda being pushed. The old problem of integration pales in comparison to male female differences in such an environment as the combat arms.
Just so you know SFC , I was in the combat arms, TANKS. Very HE-Man stuff there even without being in a big war. :) . But really there are not a lot of women in the Army (15%or so) and the combat arms are the smallest part of the Army about 15% too I guess, And tanks are the smallest branch of the combat arms. IIRC. SO just by the numbers there will hardly ever be any multiple numbers of females being on tanks. And if such a tiny % was accommodated, it would be at a cost that far outweighs any benefit, besides causing a lot of problems the Tank Corps does not need. And to tell the truth, even the most Butch, capable, female mechanics I met in the Army, could not have hacked it on tanks. If it is tried , the costs I know will be extreme. I think it would cause a sexual harassment nightmare leading not just to ruined careers and bad unit performance, but also running off many of the capable male tankers , who will always be 98-99% of the soldiers in Armor even with the most radical PC agenda being pushed. The old problem of integration pales in comparison to male female differences in such an environment as the combat arms.
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