Posted on Sep 9, 2015
Why not allow former Infantrymen (11B's) to wear the blue Infantry cord?
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I went to basic, infantry and airborne school at Ft. Benning and served as an infantryman for four years on active duty, why not let guys like me wear the blue infantry cord if we change MOS's? We earned it. I'm not talking about any other infantry accoutrements like the blue discs or crossed rifles, just the cord. I suppose I'm viewing this similarly to earning a badge or a tab.
This is a "what if" discussion - I know what they regs say. The post is meant to stimulate discussion and opinions.
This is a "what if" discussion - I know what they regs say. The post is meant to stimulate discussion and opinions.
Infantry
Badges
Dress Uniform
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 89
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A SM should retain wear of the blue cord throughout his/her career, regardless of changing MOS/units, if the SM at one time or another in the military completed the 11-series MOS-producing training, or equivalent from other service, and served a minimum of one peace-time or war-time tour in an AD infantry unit, unless properly released earlier, but not less than 1-year unless injured in peace-time or war-time and subsequently released from 11-series, or served in a NG/RC infantry unit for an equivalent increased duration to adjust to the AD tour length requirement. SMs with combined prior 11-series training and service should be recognized for their prior Infantry accomplishment that is not easily displayed on the uniform when SMs transition to another branch of the Army. There is no better way to display without medals a SMs past and/or present Infantry training and service hardship than to allow SMs to continue to wear the Infantry blue cord. Once an Infantryman, always an Infantryman!!! Change the regulation.
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SGT Scott Coleman
I agree, it identifies a special skill set that could be useful. After 4 years in the 2/504 inf 82nd abn, I joined the reserves when I went to college and proudly served my country as the Brigade photographer lol I was a sgt with jump wings and an EIB. When they had a problem in the arms room, they called me! :) It was kinda fun being a REMF :)
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SSG Bill McCoy
SGT Tim Mikles - Not quite the same reasoning. A former DS doesn't have to wear a campaign hat to be recognized as a former DS. They can wear the DS Badge.
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Without digging into regs, It is authorized if your primary MOS is 11 series, period. Once you re-classify to another MOS and it becomes your primary and you are no longer managed under the 11 CMF proponent. In other words, it is not a permanent award. The Expert Infantryman's Badge, however, is, which was my link to the "old world" after I had to give up the blue cord and discs.
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SGT (Join to see)
Until as an NCO that rated EFMB training did I appreciate how infantry men do their best to stay True Blue in their CIB where we as medics hate that anyone can try to study for their EFMB.
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Special Forces Weapons Sergeants (heavy and light), originally held 11 series MOSs before they became a separate branch in the early 1980's were not allowed to wear the blue cord. The decision was made in direct acknowledgement of the sacrifice of the Infantry. Only those who are Infantry, serving in an Infantry billet, can wear the blue cord.
Even today, as closely tied as the MOS 18B is to 11B and 11C, the blue cord is reserved only for the Infantry. They do after all, still suffer the brunt of warfare, no matter how many artilleryman or MPs have done "infantry patrols".
On a more direct note, as a CW4, how long ago was it that you were an Infantryman? Do you really think that what you have been doing for the last 15-20 years (because there is no warrant position in the Infantry) merits the blue cord? Not an insulting question, just trying to see your point of view. You obviously put the blue cord on a high pedestal. Do you think that the job you do now merits the recognition that the blue cord was originally designed for, or do you just miss the flair?
Even today, as closely tied as the MOS 18B is to 11B and 11C, the blue cord is reserved only for the Infantry. They do after all, still suffer the brunt of warfare, no matter how many artilleryman or MPs have done "infantry patrols".
On a more direct note, as a CW4, how long ago was it that you were an Infantryman? Do you really think that what you have been doing for the last 15-20 years (because there is no warrant position in the Infantry) merits the blue cord? Not an insulting question, just trying to see your point of view. You obviously put the blue cord on a high pedestal. Do you think that the job you do now merits the recognition that the blue cord was originally designed for, or do you just miss the flair?
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CW2 Donald Loughrey
It used to be that you had to serve in an Airborne unit and/or be on Jump status for 18 months to wear you jump wings if you went off status. Once that was fulfilled you got to wear them much as those who completed Ranger School could wear the tab. It made no difference if you hadn't jumped from an aircraft for years, you had earned the wings. I am much like the CW4 who originally posted with regards to this issue. I joined the Army in 1974 and went to Ft Polk La. for Infantry School. The "turning Blue" ceremony after the two day event that culminated in getting our Braid is something I'll always remember. I did 4 years as an 11B before moving on to 05H/Morse Intercept Operator, where my there was as a Radio Op for a SOT-A. My Infantry background was a plus and I did much the same with regards to patrolling etc. My point is, the Braid is a decoration that shows your accomplishment and part of your Army qualification. I think it should be worn if you earned it. I have Jump Wings...I don't and didn't need "flair". A need for such would not have kept me serving for 22 years.
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CPL Nathan Hollingsworth
Yeah I think I agree with you , I was Ordnance Branch , wheel mechanic , ( so no fancy cord but if we had one ) , if I changed MOS how long as a different MOS would I remain “Tactically and Technically Proficient “ in my original MOS ?
Leave the baubles with the serving grunts !
Leave the baubles with the serving grunts !
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LTC Marlen Ramirez
You can say the same for any other badge, device, award, or item worn on the uniform. Do you really think that have you been doing for the last 15-20 years merits you wearing the badge, device, award, item, whatever?
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Suspended Profile
Once awarded should not be taken away, not because of flair, but because it was earned, I spent 14 years in the I fantry, 12 in MI (6 as a Warrant) I believe I earned the honor of retaining the blue cord! The 2 most difficult days in my career were removing the cord and removing SFC stripes to go Warrant, best decision I made, but gut wrenching, took me longer and far more intensity to be an Infantry SFC than Warrant
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The blue infantry chord is not an award or skill badge that you can take with you when you leave the infantry. It stays with the infantry where it belongs. The high Standards within those infantry units will NEVER allow the chord to be discredited. I would never want to see the chord leave it's proper place. If you want to wear it than stay in the infantry.
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CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
This is the kind of answer I'm looking for, thanks! Others keep citing regulations, which I'm well aware of.
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CPT(P) (Join to see)
I agree with you SFC Holmes. I was Infantry prior to commissioning. I do not believe, my Infantry self would like to see the current me wearing the Blue.
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SGT Dennis Galloway
This is the most sensible answer I've seen to this long-going argument. I wore the blue cord and discs once, but I realize these are reserved to those who are actively serving with the Army infantry. For me, case closed! Don't disrespect the service of those who are NOW infantrymen. Our time has come and gone.
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SGM Gregory Tarancon IV
I lost the privilege of wearing the blue cord when I left the infantry for Special Forces. I guess you can also look at it as I traded in the "Blue Cord" for the "Green Beret". I will be an infantry at heart and I agree 100% with SFC David Holmes!
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sounds like there are a lot of butt hurt about removing them cord from your dress uniform. 1981 -1988 I wore my cord with pride. it now hangs on my bedroom wall. I knew I would have to remove my cord when I changed PMOS. for many years it hung from my review mirror
what ever happened to heritage, history, customs. Y'ALL need to stop being special snowflakes. in the words of my drill Sgt from 1980. suckit up buttercup. get over yourselves and yes I did retire with 11B40 as my secondary MOS. so I know prestige that goes with them cord. and once infantry always infantry.
what ever happened to heritage, history, customs. Y'ALL need to stop being special snowflakes. in the words of my drill Sgt from 1980. suckit up buttercup. get over yourselves and yes I did retire with 11B40 as my secondary MOS. so I know prestige that goes with them cord. and once infantry always infantry.
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CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
"This is a "what if" discussion - I know what they regs say. The post is meant to stimulate discussion and opinions."
No one is butt hurt, everyone has sucked it up and we're over ourselves. If you had read the original post you'd get the spirit of it snowflake.
No one is butt hurt, everyone has sucked it up and we're over ourselves. If you had read the original post you'd get the spirit of it snowflake.
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CPT(P) (Join to see)
Mine hangs from my mirror as well. Has gotten me some good parking at events or out of tickets...lol Good enough for me!
I would love to wear it; but, I would need to be in an Infantry Unit to feel completely comfortable.
I would love to wear it; but, I would need to be in an Infantry Unit to feel completely comfortable.
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SPC Robin Price-Dirks
As a really old school service member I never had the chance to earn the blue cord (females weren't allowed into combat positions in my early years). My brother had one though and never mentioned what it was for or how he got it. He volunteered before he was drafted and my other brother was drafted and sent to be a payroll clerk. Not much there to brag about. I never really got any awards other than rifle and hand grenade so all this is a moot point for me. I do know that walking away from my service broke my heart and I miss my "family" to this day. If I had gotten such a hard won award I would want to wear it on my uniform always.
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There has been 2 wars over the last 15.5 years, and if you weren't awarded a CIB, you should have had a chance to earn an EIB. That's your proof you were Infantry. Asking to wear a non permanent uniform item is futile.
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Back in WWII a saying was started. "He went the whole nine yards". A lot of soldiers were being killed and soldiers did not want to dwell on the subject of death. So when someone asked "What happened to Sergeant Jones?" or "Where is my buddy Private Smith?" and he had been killed in action, rather than bring up the subject of death and dying they would reply "He went the whole nine yards". If you unravel the Blue Infantry Cord.....it is 9 yards long. I wear one and I always will.
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Chief, I have two schools of thought on this.
First I think it's interesting how only the Infantry is authorized to wear their assigned color cord. Also we are the only MOS who have/are allowed to wear disks. That being said aren't the blue cord and blue disks redundant? Each one can only be worn on the dress uniform and only when Infantry is your primary MOS.
Here is a second way I look at this. Do I want some former Infantryman acting like or trying to look like he is still Infantry when he has not done that job in a few years? I have seen former Infantrymen who just 2 years ago were turning in 13 min 2 miles and knocking out Battle Drill 1A like it was nothing. Now they look like a lard ass and might pass the APFT. Let alone they couldn't explain to someone how to conduct 1A if their life depended on it.
I don't want the second guy even looking like he ever had anything to do with the Infantry. Granted this is also the guy who never earned his EIB either, which is a good thing.
First I think it's interesting how only the Infantry is authorized to wear their assigned color cord. Also we are the only MOS who have/are allowed to wear disks. That being said aren't the blue cord and blue disks redundant? Each one can only be worn on the dress uniform and only when Infantry is your primary MOS.
Here is a second way I look at this. Do I want some former Infantryman acting like or trying to look like he is still Infantry when he has not done that job in a few years? I have seen former Infantrymen who just 2 years ago were turning in 13 min 2 miles and knocking out Battle Drill 1A like it was nothing. Now they look like a lard ass and might pass the APFT. Let alone they couldn't explain to someone how to conduct 1A if their life depended on it.
I don't want the second guy even looking like he ever had anything to do with the Infantry. Granted this is also the guy who never earned his EIB either, which is a good thing.
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CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
LOL - your second point is exactly how I feel about people who go to jump school and wear jump wings but never serve in an airborne unit AND same for Ranger tabs - never serve in a Batt. Same for the Air Assault badge. The cord and disks are a bit redundant but that's fine - I think it's the cord that symbolizes having been through or in the infantry. I spent almost six years in the infantry (11B) and airborne infantry and paid my dues. Anyway, there's three schools that give up badges/tabs with no requirement to actually be in such a unit - per regs. Why is infantry school different? Side note: I can recall seeing guys who quit the 1st Ranger BN and in full BN formation they were called to post on the CSM and they had their airborne patch and Ranger unit patch cut off by the CSM with a bayonet - material underneath included. That was back in 79 - 80. I also remember some fat bodies in the infantry who always had issues with the PT test - they'd just struggle through the aftermath but they still wore those items in dress uniforms.
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SGT Scott Coleman
I hated not wearing the blue cord and blue backgrounds under my brass after being a grunt in the 2/504 82nd Abn for 4 years, but I accepted that ; I was now a REMF because I was in a reserve unit, as the Brigade photographer lmao. I still wore my 3 stripes, jump wings and EIB with pride! :)
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The question has been answered, regulations pertaining to the reason were provided and a definition was also provided. My cord sits on my Khakis in the atic. If someone really wants to wear their cord then there is a procedure and process for changes listed in the regs to do so. While I would have loved to wear mine I also understand the reasons why I couldn't. To be honest I was much more busy doing my job than worrying about my bling.
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1SG Dennis Hicks
SSG Jon Hill - SGM Marquez said it best, "it is what you were not what you are", cloth and plastic don't define you whats inside does.
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1SG Dennis Hicks
PFC Michael Hope - My demon spawn only live is Seattle, Virginia, CT and PA with some offshoots in NY and NJ. We were banned from the gene pool a generation ago :)
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form·er
adjective
1.
having previously filled a particular role or been a particular thing.
Specifically Your answer is in the question you posted.
If you are asking as a "I wish it were so even though its not"
Id say, no to that as well.... It is a coveted identifier for those that service in the position. No longer serving, no longer should be identified as such.
I know the blue cord is "Earned" and that can never be taken away from you... but the physical identifications of blue disks and the cord, well that is for who you are, not who you were.
adjective
1.
having previously filled a particular role or been a particular thing.
Specifically Your answer is in the question you posted.
If you are asking as a "I wish it were so even though its not"
Id say, no to that as well.... It is a coveted identifier for those that service in the position. No longer serving, no longer should be identified as such.
I know the blue cord is "Earned" and that can never be taken away from you... but the physical identifications of blue disks and the cord, well that is for who you are, not who you were.
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