Posted on Jun 22, 2017
SN Greg Wright
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So on several online forums, I've asserted my opinion that FC1 Rehm, who continued saving Sailors until he knew the ship would sink if they didn't close the watertight hatch (and then DID close it, thereby saving the ship but sacrificing himself and 6 others) should be eligible for the MoH for his actions, if they bear out as reported so far. Someone on another forum said something to the effect that he'll get some sort of medal for sure, but not a combat medal. So that's my question. Does the situation on the Fitz rise to the level of combat? I don't think you'll find any Sailor who says it doesn't. Opinions are welcome, but I'm hoping for a definitive answer. Note: if it's determined that the Crystal deliberately rammed the Fitz, this question becomes moot entirely.
Posted in these groups: 2dc806a0 ValorAir combat art 0134 CombatUs medals AwardsRibbons banner2 Medals
Edited 7 y ago
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SSG Carlos Madden
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I do not believe so as they do not meet the following requirements for the MoH since there there was no known enemy or hostile action:
(1) While engaged in an action against an enemy of the United States;
(2) While engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign
force; or
(3) While serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in an armed conflict against an
opposing armed force in which the United States is not a belligerent party.

However, FC1 Rehm should, and will likely receive a "Navy and Marine Corps Medal" for those actions.


http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/corres/pdf/134833v1_dodm_2016.pdf
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MAJ Corporate Buyer
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SN Greg Wright - I would say this would qualify if the incident was indeed an intentional attack on the US. If that's the case it shouldn't be any different than Pearl Harbor should it? And the MOH was awarded to 15 men for their actions that day.
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SSG Carlos Madden
SSG Carlos Madden
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MAJ (Join to see) - Great point. I'd say the only difference there is that during Pearl Harbor the sailors were certainly actively engaging and being engaged by the enemy. In this case, that is a bit more of a gray area.
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MAJ Corporate Buyer
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SSG Carlos Madden - That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
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SSG Carlos Madden - You're right, but I don't think it's too much of a stretch to classify that helmsman and/or mate as terrorists if it goes that way. Which, for the record, I'm definitely NOT pulling for (meaning, I'm holding out hope that this was just a tragic accident, and not deliberate). MAJ (Join to see)
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PO2 Rev. Frederick C. Mullis, AFI, CFM
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Since the Fitzgerald was not in a Combat area and not in a battle the MoH and the NAVY CROSS are very doubtful since both are specifically are awarded for heroism and Valor in battle. but there is always the Navy and Marine Corps Medal, the highest award that is not battle related.
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PO2 Torpedoman
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Originally I agreed with the majority of these comments, then I took a look at TM2 Henry Breault. As a submariner, TM2 shut himself and another inside the boat as it sank next to the pier. He was awarded the Medal of Honor for his actions, and survived the incident. The boat wasn't rammed either. I do believe that FC1 deserves it, but as for the others, sorry.
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MCPO Roger Collins
MCPO Roger Collins
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PO2 (Join to see) - Which boat are you talking about, I remember the Sargo and the file from an oxygen leak, but this name is not familiar to me. I was there and watched the Sargo burn, off and on for two days.
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MCPO Roger Collins
MCPO Roger Collins
7 y
James E. Smallwood MM3(SS), lost his life in the fire while taking action to save the ship. He was awarded, posthumously, the Navy and Marine Corps Medal for his heroic actions and other crew members were also awarded medals and letters of commendation for outstanding courage over and above the call of duty. On 15 April 1987, Submarine Base Pearl Harbor opened a new 17-story Bachelor Enlisted Quarters, which was dedicated on 26 February 1988 in the memory of Smallwood and the sacrifice of his life while performing in the service of his country.[1]
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MSG Michael McEleney
MSG Michael McEleney
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Unfortunatly the Navy and Marine Corps Medal is probably what he'll wind up with. The US should follow the tradition of the UK and have an award like the George Cross for extraordinary heroism that is not combat related.
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CPT Jack Durish
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Edited 7 y ago
He would only be eligible for the Soldier's Medal, one that most people don't know. It was created to acknowledge acts of valor performed outside actual combat and applies to all branches of the military
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SSG Robert Webster
SSG Robert Webster
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CPT Jack Durish see comment by PO2 Rev. Frederick C. Mullis, AFI, CFM about the Navy and Marine Corps Medal.
Soldier Medal equivalents Navy & Marine Corps - Navy and Marine Corps Medal, Air Force - Airman's Medal, and Coast Guard - Coast Guard Medal.
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Will the Sailors on the USS Fitzgerald be eligible for combat awards? Specifically, will FC1 Rehm be eligible for the MoH?
1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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This was not a combat situation, nor was it in a combat area. As such, any decoration, if awarded, would be a non-combat medal.
The Navy and Marine Corps Medal would seem appropriate.

Not to take anything away from this Petty Officer's actions, but no enemy was involved (probably).
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
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That seems the likely outcome, Top. I just feel for the families.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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SN Greg Wright - I am more interested in seeing the outcome of the investigation. This has all the hallmarks of gross negligence on the part of the Destroyer's crew on watch.
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
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1SG (Join to see) - No argument from me there, as you've probably seen from other comments in other threads about this. In fact, of all the things I'm unsure of, that one isn't among them. That bridge crew dropped the ball.
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COL Charles Williams
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SN Greg Wright I think the 1st question, would be what type of mission were they on? Not being a sailor, my vernacular my be off here. Were they on combat mission, or training mission? I think you final comment is key. It is all about circumstances. Until the facts are known, it is hard to say. In the Army, it sounds like a Soldiers Medal. If it was deemed to be a combat mission/attack, or a terrorist attack, that changes what the options are.
http://valor.defense.gov/Description-of-Awards/
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LtCol George Carlson
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Edited 7 y ago
Lots to comment on and I'll try not to be totally redundant. Certainly damage control efforts aboard ship come closer to combat than most other non-combat events. As the son of a WW2 tin-can sailor I have to admit that the ship doesn't "care" if the hole in the side was caused by a bomb, torpedo, enemy vessel, or a (assumedly) friendly vessel. The results and the demands on the crew are the same. I have the greatest respect and admiration for the courage and heroism shown by FC1 Rehm. That said, he clearly should be given the highest award appropriate. I say appropriate and know that will get some reactions. First, remember that we all tend to see award precedence as the sole definition of heroism. That's a small part of what it should be. All of the attempts to define and distinguish awards are aimed at consistency more than some totally lineal scorecard. The history of the MoH is very erratic, at best. Many were given out during the Civil War for actions that might not even rate a Navy Comm today. Many of those were subsequently downgraded. Prior to WW2 a select few were given for non-combat heroism (I think before the Navy and Marine Corps Medal and its other service equivalents were created). But between WW2 practice and the 1963 change, all of which made for a more coherent awards system, the MoH and the Navy Cross are clearly restricted to combat and short of a finding of an intentional terrorist attack, do not apply. Now we all know that the awards system is far from perfect. Any system administered by literally thousands of imperfect human beings is going to fall short. But, that should not be used as justification to totally ignore the very specific criteria. Clearly there is a lot more to learn about the collision. None of which reflect on the character of FC1 Rehm's actions. At the risk of sounding like I am making fun (and I am not), the headline of the old Naval Institute Proceedings ad for "Farwell's Rules of the Road" keeps circulating in my head: "A collision at sea can ruin your entire day."
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
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A succinct and objective summation. Thank you, Colonel.
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LtCol George Carlson
LtCol George Carlson
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SN Greg Wright you are welcome and thank you for the comment.
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MSgt George Cater
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I understand that the requirements were tightened around WW2, but there have been awards for heroism above and beyond in peacetime. One such was Ensign Henry Drexler of the USS Trenton.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Clay_Drexler

Perhaps time for an exception?
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SFC Jim Ruether
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As important as it may seem to award these sailors with some kind of posthumous award for bravery what about the guy or gal who allowed this collision to occur in the first place? Was the radar out, no commo with the captain, no collision avoidance radar? WTH someone needs to answer to this negligence!
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1SG Vet Technician
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I don't think the situation would qualify for MoH, even if it was determined if the ramming was intentional.

In my mind, an analogous situation would be a group of soldiers on a bus. Someone sees this, decided to ram the bus on a highway, and caused the bus to flip or some other accident. If a Soldier performed heroic measures, I could see the Soldier's Medal, but not MoH.

Again, that is just my take
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SN Greg Wright
SN Greg Wright
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Sadly, I think your take is right, given others' perspectives. I find myself saddened for FC1 Rehm's wife and family.
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PO3 Business Advisement
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SN Greg Wright - You make a good point though in the fact of what he accomplished and then what he had to do. And that decision cost lives on both sides. He doomed some and saved many others with the ship. That is a massive honor we (The United States of America) owe that individual.
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1stSgt Nelson Kerr
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Edited 7 y ago
Regrettably, to give combat awards there will have to be real evidence that it was enemy action not F-up. that is not fair but that is what the Regs and law require.
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PO3 Donald Murphy
PO3 Donald Murphy
7 y
Maybe not. Go to the MOH website. Tons of peacetime awardee's.
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1stSgt Nelson Kerr
1stSgt Nelson Kerr
7 y
They changed the law in 1963 it s posted below
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