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I keep getting these surveys from the TRADOC Analysis Center wanting to know how I "feel" about Females joining combat arms positions, and jobs currently closed to them. Not so sure I believe the Army really cares how I "feel" about the topic and not sure it matters.
This has been an ongoing debate in a couple units I have been in and I'd like to hear something other than: "that's a ridiculous idea", "If they can hack it, let them" and "the sexual harassment/assault rate will go up". I'd like to hear from other branches and females as well.
So, tell me, what's your take on it?
Note: Image added by RP Staff
This has been an ongoing debate in a couple units I have been in and I'd like to hear something other than: "that's a ridiculous idea", "If they can hack it, let them" and "the sexual harassment/assault rate will go up". I'd like to hear from other branches and females as well.
So, tell me, what's your take on it?
Note: Image added by RP Staff
Combat Arms
Women in the Military
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 86
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what i believe there should be women in the infantry but the only thing that would stand in the way is the sexual harassment issue, because with no disrespect its that when you have 30 men that have trained as infantrymen and never had females among the ranks your throwing fresh meat at a wolf because you have 30 men who have joked, and grab assed with each other and have moments of inappropriate stories of the opposite sex, on my belief to have for this is no females should not be among the ranks with infantry because of to many sexual harassment charges.
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PV2 (Join to see)
If a woman is tough enough to make it and pass infantry standards, I pity the man that tries to sexually harass/assault her because chances are she'd be able to beat the crap out of any man that tries.
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SFC Josh Watson
I hear that a lot. It seems to be a default generic answer. But what are your thoughts on how it will affect morale, readiness, training and logistics in an Infantry unit?
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They need to be able to be physically prepared for their jobs and put steel on target. I have the utmost confidence they will be able to do battle drills well.
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How can anyone say how effective they would or wouldn't be without giving them the chance? I'm not sure how many threads we need here to say that as long as we don't lower the standards or bend the rules to allow for an individual's success than let them try.
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I have seen a lot of discussion in this entire thread that sounded a lot like the stuff the I read about when When President Truman first integrated the Armed Forces. Back then everyone "knew" darkies could never be used for anything more that servant roles in the Navy and they were regulated to being Cooks and Stewards.
I have even seen people suggest separate units for women. Guess what, Navy people also came up with this brilliant idea as early as the late 1980s and early 1990s. Of course back the there were not enough women in the Navy with Sea Duty experience to make this feasible, but I think that was part of the plan. Put the women into a ship that was designed to fail and then say, "Here is the proof that women cannot do it." So, how many women have the experience needed to forma a Combat Infantry Unit in the Army?
Yes, WAVES served in the Navy, but we all "knew" they did not have the physiologically to actually serve at sea. Their bodies could not stand the constant rocking and rolling on ships, especially small ships like destroyers and submarines. The worst thing of course would be that rough tough male sailors would go wild if women were on ships. Rape and orgies would be commonplace and the navy would go to hell.
In spite of what naysayers predicted, African Americans have served in every rating. It is even rumored that some have become officers and Admirals. Women have also proven that they can serve in all areas of the Navy. If there is a job to be done, they do it. Women are serving on all types of ships and submarines are close to being next. Seals, probably, but not at all like that idiot GI Jane movie.
Infantry? Is the United States Army not as good and effective as the tiny Army of Israel? Look there and take a lesson. Many other countries have fully integrated their armed forces, we should be able to do the same.
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SGT Leigh Barton
The only difference between men and women is the plumbing and a few chemicals. Just like men, they are all suited to different career characteristics and temperaments. If the boots fit, issue them, if they can shoot the rifle, issue it, if they can respect what the uniform stands for, they have earned the right to be respected in return. The hand that rocks the cradle CAN make a fist. And if you've ever REALLY pissed off your old lady you know it can pack one hell of a wallop.
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Why don't we just have separate female infantry units? That seems to me like it would solve all the problems
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SSG Oliver Mathews
They did that once... And hence The Buffalo Soldiers were formed...
This is not a good idea because now you have grabbed the can of worms of segregation... which has been done and fought to the point that its almost sad.
This is not a good idea because now you have grabbed the can of worms of segregation... which has been done and fought to the point that its almost sad.
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I am of the opinion that most females can not cut it in the Infantry. I definitely think some can, but I think the majority could not. Due to this, I think it becomes a question of investment. Is it worth the money that would be spent, in an decreasing budget, to push this issue?<br><br>However, there is one point that I continually see that drives me crazy. I really hate when people say that women can't be in the Infantry because it will cause sexual harassment issues and the men won't be able to control themselves. I think that is crap. If a man can't respect a fellow soldier and keep his hands and other body parts to himself, he doesn't need to be in the military in general, much less the infantry. <br>
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Suspended Profile
Frankly, if women qualify for the infantry, my guess is men in their units will fully understand the consequences from combat buddies and the victim of overt sexual assault.
As far as investment, the same can be said of any other effort to integrate military units in the past. This is not a matter of political correctness. It is a matter of fairness.
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I have a question...what exact standards are you speaking of? PT?
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SSgt (Join to see)
Rucking the same weight, for the same distance, in the same time, doing the same amount of pull-ups, etc.
PT is huge in the infantry because the majority of the time you have to walk everywhere with your "world" on your back, in full kit, with crew served weapons and ammo dispersed amongst everyone and your own weapons with enough chow and water to sustain yourself for a week or more at a time.
Is that impossible for a woman to do? No. If weak boys can grow accustomed to it, anyone can. But is it possible for a woman to be able to do it consistently for years upon years? That is debatable. Not because women lack the mental or emotional strength to succeed in the infantry, but because they are physiologically built differently from men.
For example, a women's hips are naturally wider than a mans in order to have the ability to bear children. While a mans hips are naturally in line with the rest of his body. Now here's where some people argue it would not be physiologically in the best interests of a woman to join the infantry. The inline hips of a man allow him to carry heavy loads for long periods of time over long distances. While the offset hips of women may be fine initially, but after carrying heavy weights for long periods of time the continuous weight from gravity pulling the heavy loads downward would force the women's hips to move wider apart at the top and closer together in the bottom of the hips. Ultimately causing excruciating pain and possibly be grounds for medical separation.
Having said that, I am in no way chauvinistic. If you read my above posts and responses you should know that I do not care one way or another. At the end of the day if it is not going to make me bullet proof then I'm not getting wrapped around the axel about it.
Having said that, I think that there are plenty of specialized units out there that are looking for good women to utilize on and well beyond the front lines in a positive and bad ass manner, while getting better treatment and training than a traditional G.I.
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SFC (Join to see)
I was just wondering because I see alot of comments talking about standards but no one has said what these standards are. Also I see PT referenced alot, which even through females get graded on a different scale, almost 75% of females in the army do pass the male standards..granted they might only score a 180 on the males standards they still pass. So I was just wondering. Thank you for answering.
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As a fellow Infantryman I can personally care less if they allow women into the infantry. As long as they can perform there job. The issues I do have with it will they get pregnant to get out of going to the field or deployments. Also the amounts of sexual assaults will raise due to this. The marines have already had some success with women passing there infantry school. Had female searchers attached to us in Afghanistan they slowed down are operations at times having to conduct patrols to send them back to conduct personnel hygiene. Will males now be allowed to leave the field mid way through to get a warm shower if the move on with this issue. gone weeks with out showering in Afghanistan only to use a bottle of water and a rag or baby wipes can females do the same thing. I haven't personally seen one be able to go that same time.
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