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I've struggled with it for years, warriors. Two wives later and still struggle. Can't lie to ya'll. Battle it weekly.
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PV2 (Join to see)
I appreciate your honesty and openness about it SSG Buddy Kemper if there is anything I can do to help, please let me know.
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I don't think alcohol is the problem, or the answer for that matter. The military has been changing over the past decades. I know it is a completely different beast now, than it was when I first enlisted over a decade ago. Hell, it's different from when I retired in 2010! I believe it comes down to a loss of accountability. I was reading the Army Times several years ago, when we were in the beginning stages of transitioning from BDUs to ACUS, and one Sr officer was quoted as saying that it is a good thing, because Privates won't have to spend hours every night, pressing and starching their uniforms, and polishing their boots. The ACUs look, fit, and felt like pajamas! As a Private, I strove very hard to make sure that when I was in garrison, I showed up to morning formation with boots that you could see yourself in, and a uniform that was the pinnacle of pressed and starched. I did that because I wanted to look as good, or better, than the NCOs in charge of me, and my fellow lower enlisted personnel. It wasn't a waste of time; it was discipline. It didn't take me "hours" every night to square my uniform away. It took minutes; minutes that I enjoyed, because it was a time to reflect on the events of the day, and to help me mentally prepare for the rigors of the coming day. I was in the only LRSD unit in Korea, and while I got there only a couple of months before they reflagged as a BN STB Security Company, there was a sense of esprit de'corps, of brotherhood, and professionalism that I never saw again the rest of the time I was in the Army. The guys in my unit were the most motivated, knowledgeable, passionate individuals I ever served with, and we took our job deadly seriously. We could drink the rest of the BN under the table, just warming up, but we did it as a group. We didn't have a single alcohol-related incident the entire time I was there, until we reflagged to aforementioned Security Company, at which point we went from about 45 guys up to 120, of which most were cherry Privates. It all comes down to personal responsibility, unit cohesion, and having a moral compass.
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i truly believe that the statistics shown and what we are shown are a little on the false side, this is why 1) whenever a member is drunk or fails to fallow the 0-0-1-3 rule they are thrown into the same arena as the people that get black out drunk and do something dumb and seeing that we make up a small amount of the population it in turn shows a larger amount of people statistically "abusing" alcohol. 2)when a civilian gets drunk and goes home they do not have to check in with anyone ie quarterdeck, gate guards, LPOs. so they don't get shoved into a statistic. 3) if you policed every collage campus the way the military polices members then we would be taken out of the alcohol lime light within a week.
the odds are agents us due to the fact that we are viewed as ambassadors of the united states which paints a large bulls eye on our backs. no doubt that alcoholism is a serious thing in the military but on a nationwide scale i feel that it is not realistic to truly believe that .5% of the nations people have a larger problem with alcohol then the other 99.5% of the nation. just my 2 cents
the odds are agents us due to the fact that we are viewed as ambassadors of the united states which paints a large bulls eye on our backs. no doubt that alcoholism is a serious thing in the military but on a nationwide scale i feel that it is not realistic to truly believe that .5% of the nations people have a larger problem with alcohol then the other 99.5% of the nation. just my 2 cents
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PO2 (Join to see)
engineman = illiterate haha so ill give you a thumbs up for the kind-ish words mam
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PO2 (Join to see)
i fully agree i was only trying to put one group of people that have about the same numbers as us rather then throw the entire population in. more for arguments sake but i definitely feel the same way as you haha. they are not forced to be adults like many of us are.
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SGT Suraj Dave
Wow, someone actually down voted you because you your spelling and grammar was off. Wow.
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I don't know what else you the military can do. Proactive leadership and a service member willingness to seek help. They do safety briefs, don't allow just alcohol at command functions if at all, what else can you expect? you can't make a base dry you do that they will leave the base and you will more then lik. I am just happy i had great leadership who could knock some sense into me i owe my sobriety to my LT and my command DAPA they could of easily said you have not been in trouble and we have not heard anything so you don't need to go. But instead they said we agree with recommendation and you are going. And in the end you cant help someone who is not ready for help.
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My problem with this conversation is that some aren't admitting that this is a cause and effect situation. The cause is high stress. The effect is acting out. Whether that means alcohol, drugs, fighting, screaming and crying . . . whatever; it's about how people are wired to deal with out of control stress levels. I'll talk only about Afgan and Iraq soldiers as they were specifically mentioned in this graphic.
1. As soldiers were and are not allowed to drink in Iraq or Afghanistan, you are taking away one type of stress control, until they get back to the states and start making up for lost time.
2. Some people turn to each other for comfort in high stress. Fraternization is of course not allowed and the numbers being something like only 10 - 20% women on most bases, (in and out of uniform) chances are you weren't going to have a girl or boy friend to lean on.
3. Some people take comfort in pets. Don't get me started about the totally inhumane attitude the military has on that one. Rounding up pets and local strays to be killed regardless of the effect on your personnel is outside of cruel.
4. From what I heard the only stress relief approved by commands in combat areas was exercise. That may tire everyone out, but it can be another type of stress on top of combat stress for people that don't think running and throwing weights around is just the greatest things to do.
The job is very tough. The stress those in combat areas have to deal with is ungodly. To expect them to come home and just make nice again and have no stress issues to act out is foolish.
1. As soldiers were and are not allowed to drink in Iraq or Afghanistan, you are taking away one type of stress control, until they get back to the states and start making up for lost time.
2. Some people turn to each other for comfort in high stress. Fraternization is of course not allowed and the numbers being something like only 10 - 20% women on most bases, (in and out of uniform) chances are you weren't going to have a girl or boy friend to lean on.
3. Some people take comfort in pets. Don't get me started about the totally inhumane attitude the military has on that one. Rounding up pets and local strays to be killed regardless of the effect on your personnel is outside of cruel.
4. From what I heard the only stress relief approved by commands in combat areas was exercise. That may tire everyone out, but it can be another type of stress on top of combat stress for people that don't think running and throwing weights around is just the greatest things to do.
The job is very tough. The stress those in combat areas have to deal with is ungodly. To expect them to come home and just make nice again and have no stress issues to act out is foolish.
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SSG Paul Lanciault
The problem is physical, mental and spiritual. All three have to be addressed if there is any hope of recovery.
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Alcoholism is a problem. But I think binge drinking is more prevalent. I've written about this in a post titled Alcohol Abuse: Changing Attitudes to Change the World, which you can Google if interested. Commanders must have the courage to tell the people in their command that drinking to get drunk (i.e. alcohol abuse) is not acceptable. But first, they must actually believe it themselves. That means setting the example and laying down the gauntlet, regardless of past personal behavior. For some, guidance to "drink responsibly" is not clear enough. Let there be no confusion. Drinking to get drunk (abusing alcohol) is wrong. Until commanders acknowledge this and spell lit out in black and white, their men and women will continue riding the line in a world of grey.
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I have dealt with Drinking on a serious level. It nearly consumed my entire offtime and money for about a year and a half after I came back from Iraq in 2005. As concern for myself and troops during my tenure as an a NCO grew, stemming from our battalions drinking related incidents including a few unfortunate fatal accidents I took a real hard look at why is that troops were getting in trouble. So I started inviting my peers to drink at my house on base. I provided a DD and a safe environment and more than just alcohol for them to drink and drinking became less the issue as Madden and football games and even Beer pong became the reason to hang out. I also started taking my young E-3s and below on outings with my fellow NCOs to do non drinking activities. I would take them bowling, movie trips, beach cook outs and really giving them a sense of belonging and curing loneliness boredom and encouraging a stronger bond in our team. I even took advantage of the my Senior Lances roles in their peer groups and would pay for cookouts that they held at the barracks without me or NCOs. It takes giving a damn at the NCO level. We are right there where the rubber meets the road.
In the bigger picture Officers and SNCOs can take the Corpsmens lead and be as graphic and explicit when dealing with serious issues. Corpsmen showed us pics that haunt me til this day and made me more protective in my "love life". Giving a stat and wagging the proverbial finger is one thing but showing graphic pictures of the consequences and having former servicemembers willing to share their story could have a bigger impact than we may at first believe.
In the bigger picture Officers and SNCOs can take the Corpsmens lead and be as graphic and explicit when dealing with serious issues. Corpsmen showed us pics that haunt me til this day and made me more protective in my "love life". Giving a stat and wagging the proverbial finger is one thing but showing graphic pictures of the consequences and having former servicemembers willing to share their story could have a bigger impact than we may at first believe.
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Also with alcohol... from what I heard is that other countries allowed alcohol while the US didn't So SMs are going without for so long that they long for it and go crazy when they come back. Not only that... stress from the deployment, things that happened during (if any.... i.e. PTSD) and so forth can have factors into alcoholism. Oh my I might be on this topic for awhile. LOL
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Suspended Profile
Alcohol (or in a broader look all substance abuse) has always been a problem in the military. I used to ask my sailors who got in trouble re booze: "Do you have an alcohol problem?" They would always answer "no sir." My response? "If alcohol causes you problems you have an alcohol problem". Denial is not a river in Egypt.
I suspect the problem is even worse now, though. After almost 15 years of combat operations PTSD is rampant among A/D and vets. The military are not able to acknowledge or properly respond to PTSD for myriad reasons. The result is lots of troops who are hurting.
I have seen estimates that 25% of current soldiers or vets from the current wars have PTSD. From what I've seen, I'd say it's closer to 75%, but that's a WAG, not a scientific survey.
Nonetheless, the point is that far too many troops and vets are hurting, and not getting help - so what do they do? They self-medicate. This then leads to further problems because they get busted for DUI, under-age drinking, positive Urinalysis, etc., both on base and in town.
Thankfully, some wise civic leaders have established Veterans' Courts. If a vet with PTSD gets in trouble and goes to the Veterans' Court they are given a chance - participate in two years of intensive inpatient and outpatient treatment and keep your nose clean. If you do, at the end, the conviction is expunged.
The last thing a vet with PTSD needs is to go to prison. They certainly won't get their PTSD treated there, and when they get out, they have yet another major handicap.
Until DOD starts actively acknowledging and treating PTSD for A/D troops and setting them up for better outcomes on ETS, the problem will continue to fester. Sadly, DOD never will do, because to admit there is a problem would destroy readiness - imagine what would happen if all of the sudden 75% of the troops were no longer deployable?!?!
I suspect the problem is even worse now, though. After almost 15 years of combat operations PTSD is rampant among A/D and vets. The military are not able to acknowledge or properly respond to PTSD for myriad reasons. The result is lots of troops who are hurting.
I have seen estimates that 25% of current soldiers or vets from the current wars have PTSD. From what I've seen, I'd say it's closer to 75%, but that's a WAG, not a scientific survey.
Nonetheless, the point is that far too many troops and vets are hurting, and not getting help - so what do they do? They self-medicate. This then leads to further problems because they get busted for DUI, under-age drinking, positive Urinalysis, etc., both on base and in town.
Thankfully, some wise civic leaders have established Veterans' Courts. If a vet with PTSD gets in trouble and goes to the Veterans' Court they are given a chance - participate in two years of intensive inpatient and outpatient treatment and keep your nose clean. If you do, at the end, the conviction is expunged.
The last thing a vet with PTSD needs is to go to prison. They certainly won't get their PTSD treated there, and when they get out, they have yet another major handicap.
Until DOD starts actively acknowledging and treating PTSD for A/D troops and setting them up for better outcomes on ETS, the problem will continue to fester. Sadly, DOD never will do, because to admit there is a problem would destroy readiness - imagine what would happen if all of the sudden 75% of the troops were no longer deployable?!?!
SGT (Join to see)
I have seen a large number of individuals have a problem with alcohol. I think it's a huge issue but I am thankful that there is ASAP, AA, Substance Abuse Clinics and the like. I have seen many men and women throughout several branches make a real turn around using such programs and it encourages me to strive to help others.
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While I was in I had bouts with the beer bottle sometimes I won other times it won. I will say that when my stress level increased so did my beer consumption. There was a time that my wife would look at the trashcan before asking how my day was. Did it affect me as a person, did affect my career not too much.
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MAJ David Vermillion
Having served many years in the military and commanding three companies, I can say without a shadow of a doubt that nothing good comes from alcohol and many families are destroyed because of it. If you can possibly quit drinking , please do and if you can avoid it , please do. You will have health and more money and you won't lose your family.
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