Posted on Jul 19, 2018
Should We Be Upset At Those Who “Dodged The Draft”?
250K
6.15K
2.36K
646
646
0
I’ve seen a number of posts elsewhere provocatively calling President Trump a “draft dodger” for utilizing three educational deferments and one medical exclusion during Vietnam. I know this can be a sensitive issue for many of us who have served. Many of my military friends seem to want to pile on, and comment with disdain over his actions, and this issue. Some of this is just politics, for others it’s more personal.
I’d like to present a position here that may be unpopular with some. As a freedom loving American who voluntarily served in the US Army and Michigan National Guard for 22 years, including a tour in Iraq (2004-2005), I am thankful that I’ve never had to contend with an active draft. Most of us here have served in the military. Most of us served voluntarily; some were forced to “serve”. I’ve heard some who were conscripted say they are thankful they ended up in the military, or that they were thinking about volunteering anyway. I’ve also heard some say it was the worst thing that’s ever happened to them. There are still others who can’t comment because they didn’t make it back alive.
Most of us who joined the military will tell you they served to protect the freedom that is America, and we DO enjoy a great many freedoms that people in other countries do not. Now for the controversy. Can we include a draft as one of those freedoms? I contend we cannot. I’ve heard arguments for the utility, and necessity of a draft to fight our wars. But what is a draft when we REALLY take time to consider its nature. I’d like to place two definitions below to set the premise that guides my thinking on this issue. (I always use Merriam Webster for consistency’s sake.)
Servitude: “a condition in which one lacks liberty especially to determine one's course of action or way of life.”
Slavery: “a person held in servitude as the chattel of another
: one that is completely subservient to a dominating influence“
Given these two definitions, it’s hard to argue that a draft doesn’t, at best fit the first definition, and at worst the second. When confronted with being drafted, we are given a “choice” either go to war, put your life in danger and do what you’re told, or go to jail. It’s a false choice, because either way you lose the choice to determine your life’s course of action, or you become a slave to the prison system. When I’ve made this argument, the replies, and questions seem to indicate that it’s ok to draft people for a host of reasons, and I have a host of reasons in disagreement.
“It’s a price we have to pay to live in a free country.”
Are we really free if our government can place us into servitude, or slavery without due process?
“Other countries do it.”
We’re not other countries. We’re America, and we abolished servitude, and slavery over 150 years ago. Why would we want to resurrect slavery to fight wars?
“How can we count on volunteers to enlist in great enough numbers to fight our wars?”
How about we offer commensurate pay and benefits that will draw enough citizens to volunteer? If that doesn’t work, perhaps our government should re-think the necessity of that particular engagement.
“What if we’re invaded or we’re needed to fight a great injustice somewhere else?”
If we’re invaded, one suspects there’ll be no shortage of volunteers, civilian, or military. If the cause is just, and the danger real, America has never had a shortage of volunteers.
“Don’t you find it dishonest to use deferrals, or medical exemptions to avoid the draft when others didn’t do so?”
Those deferrals, and exemptions were legal, weren’t they? Would you call taking your mortgage interest deduction, or other legal deductions to lower your tax liability as dishonest?
All of these questions, and answers, are ancillary though, because these questions ALL avoid, bypass, or totally ignore the basic premise that a draft is based upon involuntary servitude at best, and slavery at worst. So, when someone gets all up in arms about President Trump, or anybody else “dodging the draft” by taking legal deferrals, I say, “I don’t blame them”. I tell them I didn’t blame President Clinton for avoiding the draft, and I don’t blame President Trump either. My support of President Clinton in this regard back in the 1990’s certainly caused some consternation among my Republican friends. It’s the price one pays for being philosophically honest, and consistent. Some have asked, about those who fled the country to Canada to avoid the draft, while others went along with it and were deployed to Vietnam. My answer is that I didn’t blame black slaves from fleeing slavery to Canada in the 19th century nor do I blame anybody else for fleeing to Canada to escape our slavery of the Vietnam era.
I understand that the military isn’t for everybody, and we don’t want just anybody fighting next to us. I want people fighting next to me who volunteered. Someone who has that special love of country, of service, and of unit that promotes an effective force.
In summary, I start from the basic premise that a draft is involuntary servitude/slavery, and therefore I can’t blame anybody for avoiding such bonds, either within the system of deferments, and exemptions, or outside the system by fleeing the country. America is a great country because we did away with things like slavery and spearheaded the concept of economic and individual liberty. These concepts led to the greatest worldwide advancements of production, technology and efficiency ever known previous to the founding of our great nation.
I’m sincerely interested in your thoughts, comments, or questions on this issue.
I’d like to present a position here that may be unpopular with some. As a freedom loving American who voluntarily served in the US Army and Michigan National Guard for 22 years, including a tour in Iraq (2004-2005), I am thankful that I’ve never had to contend with an active draft. Most of us here have served in the military. Most of us served voluntarily; some were forced to “serve”. I’ve heard some who were conscripted say they are thankful they ended up in the military, or that they were thinking about volunteering anyway. I’ve also heard some say it was the worst thing that’s ever happened to them. There are still others who can’t comment because they didn’t make it back alive.
Most of us who joined the military will tell you they served to protect the freedom that is America, and we DO enjoy a great many freedoms that people in other countries do not. Now for the controversy. Can we include a draft as one of those freedoms? I contend we cannot. I’ve heard arguments for the utility, and necessity of a draft to fight our wars. But what is a draft when we REALLY take time to consider its nature. I’d like to place two definitions below to set the premise that guides my thinking on this issue. (I always use Merriam Webster for consistency’s sake.)
Servitude: “a condition in which one lacks liberty especially to determine one's course of action or way of life.”
Slavery: “a person held in servitude as the chattel of another
: one that is completely subservient to a dominating influence“
Given these two definitions, it’s hard to argue that a draft doesn’t, at best fit the first definition, and at worst the second. When confronted with being drafted, we are given a “choice” either go to war, put your life in danger and do what you’re told, or go to jail. It’s a false choice, because either way you lose the choice to determine your life’s course of action, or you become a slave to the prison system. When I’ve made this argument, the replies, and questions seem to indicate that it’s ok to draft people for a host of reasons, and I have a host of reasons in disagreement.
“It’s a price we have to pay to live in a free country.”
Are we really free if our government can place us into servitude, or slavery without due process?
“Other countries do it.”
We’re not other countries. We’re America, and we abolished servitude, and slavery over 150 years ago. Why would we want to resurrect slavery to fight wars?
“How can we count on volunteers to enlist in great enough numbers to fight our wars?”
How about we offer commensurate pay and benefits that will draw enough citizens to volunteer? If that doesn’t work, perhaps our government should re-think the necessity of that particular engagement.
“What if we’re invaded or we’re needed to fight a great injustice somewhere else?”
If we’re invaded, one suspects there’ll be no shortage of volunteers, civilian, or military. If the cause is just, and the danger real, America has never had a shortage of volunteers.
“Don’t you find it dishonest to use deferrals, or medical exemptions to avoid the draft when others didn’t do so?”
Those deferrals, and exemptions were legal, weren’t they? Would you call taking your mortgage interest deduction, or other legal deductions to lower your tax liability as dishonest?
All of these questions, and answers, are ancillary though, because these questions ALL avoid, bypass, or totally ignore the basic premise that a draft is based upon involuntary servitude at best, and slavery at worst. So, when someone gets all up in arms about President Trump, or anybody else “dodging the draft” by taking legal deferrals, I say, “I don’t blame them”. I tell them I didn’t blame President Clinton for avoiding the draft, and I don’t blame President Trump either. My support of President Clinton in this regard back in the 1990’s certainly caused some consternation among my Republican friends. It’s the price one pays for being philosophically honest, and consistent. Some have asked, about those who fled the country to Canada to avoid the draft, while others went along with it and were deployed to Vietnam. My answer is that I didn’t blame black slaves from fleeing slavery to Canada in the 19th century nor do I blame anybody else for fleeing to Canada to escape our slavery of the Vietnam era.
I understand that the military isn’t for everybody, and we don’t want just anybody fighting next to us. I want people fighting next to me who volunteered. Someone who has that special love of country, of service, and of unit that promotes an effective force.
In summary, I start from the basic premise that a draft is involuntary servitude/slavery, and therefore I can’t blame anybody for avoiding such bonds, either within the system of deferments, and exemptions, or outside the system by fleeing the country. America is a great country because we did away with things like slavery and spearheaded the concept of economic and individual liberty. These concepts led to the greatest worldwide advancements of production, technology and efficiency ever known previous to the founding of our great nation.
I’m sincerely interested in your thoughts, comments, or questions on this issue.
Vietnam War
Vietnam
Donald Trump
Military service
Service
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 705
2
2
0
Sorry hit post by accident Starting over
I was drafted in 1969 and went to Vietnam with a combat support MOS (field wireman) but was assigned as a clerk at USARV Hq at Long Binh no doubt because I had a college degree
I didn’t want to be drafted or to go to Vietnam, not because I opposed the war or thought immoral (I didn’t). I simply didn’t want to die and believed that I would if I were But I also was t going to ru or hide as I believed then, as I do now, that citizenship has obligations as well as benefits
The draft system when I was drafted in 1968 was a corrupt institution. It was applied with no transparency by local boards and families with influence and connections did get their sons out of the process. Yes, I resent that those individuals didn’t serve as much as I resent those that left the country to avoid service.
I had a college deferment for 4 years I didn’t view it as draft dodging then or now On reflection, however, I view it was unfair to others that didn’t have the where with all to go to college I believe citizens should be treated equally and I should have had no more rights than others based on ability to pay for college a fair system would be to have put every one on the same playing field with service required between ages of 18-22 regardless of what you were doing or who your family knew
While I hated being drafted and going to Vietnam, again on reflection, it was good for me It matured me and taught me to stand on my own two feet I need look at the younger generations in my own family to see that service would have done them a lot of good I believe mandatory national service including a fairly administered draft would be good for the country now. We have to many that may be adults in age but not in character
Now back to the question should we be upset with draft dodgers? My response is it’s been too long ago to be “upset” But yes I have and do in the exercise of my right to vote, give preference to those that served.
I was drafted in 1969 and went to Vietnam with a combat support MOS (field wireman) but was assigned as a clerk at USARV Hq at Long Binh no doubt because I had a college degree
I didn’t want to be drafted or to go to Vietnam, not because I opposed the war or thought immoral (I didn’t). I simply didn’t want to die and believed that I would if I were But I also was t going to ru or hide as I believed then, as I do now, that citizenship has obligations as well as benefits
The draft system when I was drafted in 1968 was a corrupt institution. It was applied with no transparency by local boards and families with influence and connections did get their sons out of the process. Yes, I resent that those individuals didn’t serve as much as I resent those that left the country to avoid service.
I had a college deferment for 4 years I didn’t view it as draft dodging then or now On reflection, however, I view it was unfair to others that didn’t have the where with all to go to college I believe citizens should be treated equally and I should have had no more rights than others based on ability to pay for college a fair system would be to have put every one on the same playing field with service required between ages of 18-22 regardless of what you were doing or who your family knew
While I hated being drafted and going to Vietnam, again on reflection, it was good for me It matured me and taught me to stand on my own two feet I need look at the younger generations in my own family to see that service would have done them a lot of good I believe mandatory national service including a fairly administered draft would be good for the country now. We have to many that may be adults in age but not in character
Now back to the question should we be upset with draft dodgers? My response is it’s been too long ago to be “upset” But yes I have and do in the exercise of my right to vote, give preference to those that served.
(2)
(0)
SSG Gerhard S.
Thank you for your service, and for sharing your experiences, and thoughts on the issue of the draft.
The involuntary-servitude nature of the draft aside: I would ask if you think pressing 6 million 18-20 year-olds into mandatory (involuntary) military service every year is realistic economically, or otherwise?
Regards, and thank you again for your thoughtful comments.
The involuntary-servitude nature of the draft aside: I would ask if you think pressing 6 million 18-20 year-olds into mandatory (involuntary) military service every year is realistic economically, or otherwise?
Regards, and thank you again for your thoughtful comments.
(1)
(0)
SP5 Larry Boggs
We do lots of mandatory things as citizens that we may or may not like I agree we should take mandatory military service more seriously than other mandatory requirements, as it can get young men (and now women) killed.
But I believe democracies should have armies composed mostly of ordinary citizrns, not a professional army Out system of a core regular army supported by a standing reserve in the form of the national guard and service reserve programs and a conscripted force when a major war is fought served our country well from World War 1 onward until Vietnam. A benefit of a conscripted army is that we citizens pay more attention when we have that component I also believe unfair to put the burden of rising their life on a very few citizens And in all 4 of our wars of the last century, ordinary Americans that were drafted did their job well, and none better than the combat soldiers and Marines in Vietnam
I became an opponent of the Vietnam War when I came to the conclusion that we were sending men to die in a war that could not be won mostly because of the rules of engagement imposed on fighting it Had we not had parents concerned about their sons God knows how long it would have gone on I supported the war at first but do you really think it would have gone on for 20 plus years if a component of the force had been draftees? We should have hot in and got out as we did in the first Iraq War
That’s a long way from the question posed but I wanted to respond
And thank t you for thinking my first response was thoughtful Your original comment and response were as well And thank you for your service as well
But I believe democracies should have armies composed mostly of ordinary citizrns, not a professional army Out system of a core regular army supported by a standing reserve in the form of the national guard and service reserve programs and a conscripted force when a major war is fought served our country well from World War 1 onward until Vietnam. A benefit of a conscripted army is that we citizens pay more attention when we have that component I also believe unfair to put the burden of rising their life on a very few citizens And in all 4 of our wars of the last century, ordinary Americans that were drafted did their job well, and none better than the combat soldiers and Marines in Vietnam
I became an opponent of the Vietnam War when I came to the conclusion that we were sending men to die in a war that could not be won mostly because of the rules of engagement imposed on fighting it Had we not had parents concerned about their sons God knows how long it would have gone on I supported the war at first but do you really think it would have gone on for 20 plus years if a component of the force had been draftees? We should have hot in and got out as we did in the first Iraq War
That’s a long way from the question posed but I wanted to respond
And thank t you for thinking my first response was thoughtful Your original comment and response were as well And thank you for your service as well
(0)
(0)
SP5 Larry Boggs
I am not sure how many would be necessary to fulfill the need But certainly it is economically feasible Cheaper than the all volunteer army for sure I was paid a max of $260 a month in 1970
I believe we have benefits as citizens and should be prepared to serve our country as well It can just be benefits and no price to pay Ultimately, as the signs said all over Fort Knox when I did basic there: Freedom is not Free That was true then and is still true today
I believe we have benefits as citizens and should be prepared to serve our country as well It can just be benefits and no price to pay Ultimately, as the signs said all over Fort Knox when I did basic there: Freedom is not Free That was true then and is still true today
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
Trump dodged the draft? yes-but so did 3 other Presidents-Clinton Bush and yes,Biden.Two used a bogus medical ailment (Trump and Biden) and two used other reasons that were not legitimate.I explained all this in previous post. I may be more sensitive than most-spent 32 months in Vietnam. One of my jobs in Vietnam was a company commander-had about half draftees-they did fine in combat.
(2)
(0)
SSG Gerhard S.
Thank you Sir for your voluntary service, and for sharing your thoughts, and experiences regarding this important issue.
(0)
(0)
COL Jim Lincoln
Let me add:One of the most used exemptions from the draft was college attendance-But Congress removed it in 1968..
(1)
(0)
2
2
0
For those of us who were of draft age during the period 1968-1973, we remember how hated the military and its members were at that time, as though belonging to the military meant that somehow you were responsible for the Vietnam conflict. Evading the draft thru deferments was a cottage industry. I admire and salute those who through conscription or through their own election, served in the armed forces in Vietnam or in other support billets wherever they were. But the pressure to stay out was great in most US cities and on college campuses...a world far removed from today's public perception of military service.
(2)
(0)
2
2
0
When I was in there were a lot of senior enlisted that had a star in their national defense medal, I was in pre 9/11. Those guys were my friends, they either volunteered, or received an invitation from the government to take an all expenses paid trip to Southeast Asia that they really did not like to talk about at all. When I got out I met a lot of people that declined those free government trips. I will tell you this, I am really glad that the people that refused those trips are ageing out of the workforce because they are pretty useless. I know and knew a lot of guys that went, also some that were asked to go and didn't, and a lot that were never asked to go, The ones that went, and the ones that were never asked to go ranged from messed up, alright and all the way to really great people, the ones that were asked to go and didn't were almost always people that would stab you in the back to get the least bit ahead every chance they got. Lesson learned, never trust a draft dodger, they will do whatever it takes to get ahead and they have no problem throwing anyone under the bus to get what they want.
(2)
(0)
2
2
0
Why didn't you mention Clinton doing the Rough Scholar route to get out of the draft or Bidens 5 deferrals for medical reasons when he was a football star and an lifeguard?
(2)
(0)
SSG Gerhard S.
Thank you for taking the time to comment on the question. If you had read the whole thing, you'd find that I did mention Clinton, and that I don't blame him, nor anyone else, for doing whatever they can to avoid servitude, or slavery. As for Biden, I wrote this article over 5 years ago, so he wasn't even a president at the time. Respectful regards, and thank you for your service.
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
Most of these guys are 70-80 years old. GIVE IT A REST. When did the draft end? Try 1973. I sure most of us could care less. They had a choice to make and made it. I had friend in both--dodgers and service members of which I had a cousin killed in Viet Nam. I lost friend because of the war. It's over. The US was not victorious. LIFE GOES ON.
(2)
(0)
SP5 Delphis Kaczowski
The US Army is down almost 50,000 troops today & going lower. Maybe we can make ROBOTS that carry guns like the ROBO DOGS????? Solution on the draft/conscription is DRAFT women equally.
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
Draft ended 50 years ago. Many are retired or deceased. They made a free choice, knowing the consequences. At least they made a choice and lived with it. At this point, and military service is not required for public office, the issue is moot.
(2)
(0)
SP5 Wick Humble
You saying it's moot doesn't make it so, MAJ. The guys who dodged the draft, or ran to Canada made choices; we conscripts did not choose, we were chosen! It's not simply serving that qualifies a person for public office, it's good attitude and honesty -- not hypocrisy and disrespect to veterans. Sunny-day patriots: Don't talk the talk if you couldn't (pun intended) walk the walk! Yes many are deceased, including many draftees.
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
We are a nation of free people; in concept, at least. Freedom requires us to be responsible for our convictions. If we're to go to war because some German clown wants to murder citizens, I'm there. If we're to go to war because some rich American clown wants to stop Iranian oil fields from being nationalized? Because some other rich American clown wants to keep corporate property safe in Viet Nam? Or manage pistachio nut prices? I'm on the side of General Smedley Butler. The US military is outside of its moral use when mobilized for greed. It is the duty of a free person to refuse such service. When the full force of the US government will be turned against only the least powerful dissenters - never rich kids, never college kids, never a preacher's kid - I refuse to question the way those citizens chose to avoid forced inscription on behalf of men who guard their own children with fake commissions and bribes.
To add context to my views: I am a disabled combat veteran, my father died of injuries sustained in Viet Nam, his father unknowingly flew bombing runs over his little brother's dead body on the shores of Peleliu, my mother met my father as she tended the wounds of our service members as a corpsman, her father survived a life "half-assed" after literally leaving the other half somewhere in Korea and her brother, a man I remember as being hilariously funny and kind when I was a child, now occupies the last of his years staring at a wall and refusing to speak to anyone but his wife. My sister nearly died of blood loss from an injury as a Navy electrician in the Western Pacific, requiring a direct transfusion to buy time for surgery. Her son, my nephew, recently making the rank of veteran, marks the first generation in my family's American history to avoid military trauma. We are a family who has served continuously since WW1, never drafted. So please don't tell me how I undervalue honor. I volunteered, I don't regret volunteering, yet I did so to preserve the right of others to refuse that path.
The only draft skipping people I abhor are the Ted Nugent types, people who go to extremes to shirk their military duty only to spend the rest of their lives in faux manliness waving guns and calling others cowards. Never mock someone for not having the courage to do what you literally crapped your pants to avoid doing.
To add context to my views: I am a disabled combat veteran, my father died of injuries sustained in Viet Nam, his father unknowingly flew bombing runs over his little brother's dead body on the shores of Peleliu, my mother met my father as she tended the wounds of our service members as a corpsman, her father survived a life "half-assed" after literally leaving the other half somewhere in Korea and her brother, a man I remember as being hilariously funny and kind when I was a child, now occupies the last of his years staring at a wall and refusing to speak to anyone but his wife. My sister nearly died of blood loss from an injury as a Navy electrician in the Western Pacific, requiring a direct transfusion to buy time for surgery. Her son, my nephew, recently making the rank of veteran, marks the first generation in my family's American history to avoid military trauma. We are a family who has served continuously since WW1, never drafted. So please don't tell me how I undervalue honor. I volunteered, I don't regret volunteering, yet I did so to preserve the right of others to refuse that path.
The only draft skipping people I abhor are the Ted Nugent types, people who go to extremes to shirk their military duty only to spend the rest of their lives in faux manliness waving guns and calling others cowards. Never mock someone for not having the courage to do what you literally crapped your pants to avoid doing.
(2)
(0)
SSG Gerhard S.
Thank you for your voluntary service, and for sharing your family's extensive history of voluntary service, and loss. Your thoughts on this issue are greatly appreciated.
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
I can honestly say that everyone made their own choice at the time they were presented it. They have to live with it, and any and all repercussions that come of it, namely any negative views on it. I generally have an attitude that I just keep to myself at this point, and worry about the things I can control. This is not one of them. I chose to serve my country (twice), and I know I can generally count on someone who volunteered to serve to have my back if the situation were to arise. Take that for what its worth…
(2)
(0)
A1C Medrick "Rick" DeVaney
If One Is In Charge Of An Operation, An Has The Authority To Make Decisions,
And Must Make Decisions To The Best Of His Abilities,
Then "YES" He Should Be Responsible For The Results,
But As Some Decisions Are Tough To Make, And Errors Are Bound To Happen,
He Must ALSO Be Allowed To Change His Mind & Plan To Handle The Issues Differently.
And Must Make Decisions To The Best Of His Abilities,
Then "YES" He Should Be Responsible For The Results,
But As Some Decisions Are Tough To Make, And Errors Are Bound To Happen,
He Must ALSO Be Allowed To Change His Mind & Plan To Handle The Issues Differently.
(1)
(0)
2
2
0
Very articulate and persuasive statement, Sarge. Thanks. A few thoughts:
I agree with you about Clinton’s right to take advantage of the law and not serve. What I have a LOT of trouble with is his going to London and demonstrating against the Vietnam War. Americans don’t do that, not in foreign countries. To me, that’s tantamount to giving aid and comfort to the enemy, which I find very hard to forget.
Maybe you said this when you discussed people who ran, but to me taking the oath, serving, then jumping a plane to Sweden when your orders came is in a whole nother category. I grew up with a kid who did this. A year or so later one of the local DJ’s did a live, overseas interview with him in which he complained about the bad press he’d been getting. The radio guy asked him, “Well what did you expect, Buddy? A medal of honor?” Always did like that DJ.
Oddly, the army in Vietnam was mostly volunteer in the sense that nobody really had to go. There were just too many ways out. Bone spurs from a friendly doctor. Dump sugar in your urine sample and become a diabetic-for-a-day. Enroll in your local junior college, knock up some girl and turn into a daddy, become a teacher. Take off your clothes, run downtown naked, get busted as a lunatic, then try to enlist and tell the recruiting sgt you “want to kill Charlie.” Find religion. There were so many dodges anybody could beat the draft.
I agree with you about Clinton’s right to take advantage of the law and not serve. What I have a LOT of trouble with is his going to London and demonstrating against the Vietnam War. Americans don’t do that, not in foreign countries. To me, that’s tantamount to giving aid and comfort to the enemy, which I find very hard to forget.
Maybe you said this when you discussed people who ran, but to me taking the oath, serving, then jumping a plane to Sweden when your orders came is in a whole nother category. I grew up with a kid who did this. A year or so later one of the local DJ’s did a live, overseas interview with him in which he complained about the bad press he’d been getting. The radio guy asked him, “Well what did you expect, Buddy? A medal of honor?” Always did like that DJ.
Oddly, the army in Vietnam was mostly volunteer in the sense that nobody really had to go. There were just too many ways out. Bone spurs from a friendly doctor. Dump sugar in your urine sample and become a diabetic-for-a-day. Enroll in your local junior college, knock up some girl and turn into a daddy, become a teacher. Take off your clothes, run downtown naked, get busted as a lunatic, then try to enlist and tell the recruiting sgt you “want to kill Charlie.” Find religion. There were so many dodges anybody could beat the draft.
(2)
(0)
SSG Gerhard S.
You make some great points, worthy of consideration. Thank you for sharing them all with us, and also for serving.
(0)
(0)
SP5 Delphis Kaczowski
I keep seeing ways out of the draft; #1; Get a sex change because they don't draft women. #2; Have dual citizenship & go back where you came from. #3; Kiss the Army recruiter. Want more?
(0)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google