Posted on Mar 16, 2018
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I just watched a video of a group of Marines having a "pileon" in a K-Span in 29 Palms on CAX. It brought back memories of my own platoon and our own little "hazing" rituals while bored and out in the field training. If you have ever been on a CAX you will know it's 3 weeks of waiting being bored and a week of actual training, that's a lot of time to kill.
We had our own little version of a pileone where it was 1 person vs the rest of the group. We would clear one side of the K-Span and 1 person would be selected (usually the boot Marine who was on their first CAX). And we would rush them, we had a few rules, no punching or kicking or biting, no major bodily harm. The object was for the one person make one in the group tap out in an allotted amount of time, if they didn't they got 5 minute break and it started all over again. If they did manage to make a person tap out, that person was let up to join the group and the person who tapped out would be made to stand alone. And we would do this every night until everyone had had a turn. We even did it with our LT when he joined us one one of the smaller training ops.
There were sometimes injuries, I once had a cot broken over my back when I got rushed and slammed onto it by a few overzealous people, it hurt like a bitch but there was no serious damage.
Some of the senior enlisted and officers would stop by because they heard the noise, but they never stopped us or reprimanded us.
Here is where I pose the question. When does an activity like this become hazing and what would you consider hazing? The Marine Corps has been called out a lot on hazing in the past with "pining." If you don't know what pining is, it's when you are given a new rank or award and after they put it on you you, they leave the backing off and people take turns smashing it into your chest or collar bone.
I don't believe what we did was smart, we were after all a bunch of stupid bored kids and looking back on it could have ended VERY badly. But I do know that it did bring us all closer together as a unit.
So what is that fine line between activities like this that while dangerous does improve moral and unit cohesion among the group and actual hazing?
We had our own little version of a pileone where it was 1 person vs the rest of the group. We would clear one side of the K-Span and 1 person would be selected (usually the boot Marine who was on their first CAX). And we would rush them, we had a few rules, no punching or kicking or biting, no major bodily harm. The object was for the one person make one in the group tap out in an allotted amount of time, if they didn't they got 5 minute break and it started all over again. If they did manage to make a person tap out, that person was let up to join the group and the person who tapped out would be made to stand alone. And we would do this every night until everyone had had a turn. We even did it with our LT when he joined us one one of the smaller training ops.
There were sometimes injuries, I once had a cot broken over my back when I got rushed and slammed onto it by a few overzealous people, it hurt like a bitch but there was no serious damage.
Some of the senior enlisted and officers would stop by because they heard the noise, but they never stopped us or reprimanded us.
Here is where I pose the question. When does an activity like this become hazing and what would you consider hazing? The Marine Corps has been called out a lot on hazing in the past with "pining." If you don't know what pining is, it's when you are given a new rank or award and after they put it on you you, they leave the backing off and people take turns smashing it into your chest or collar bone.
I don't believe what we did was smart, we were after all a bunch of stupid bored kids and looking back on it could have ended VERY badly. But I do know that it did bring us all closer together as a unit.
So what is that fine line between activities like this that while dangerous does improve moral and unit cohesion among the group and actual hazing?
Hazing
Morale
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 9
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It’s hazing when it is unwanted attention. It’s bonding when it is mutually agreed on, without coercion and improves unit morale and esprit de corp.
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SSG (ret) William Martin
Cpl Tom Surdi - I turn 41 next month. I am a pretty tame and mellow guy in my older age. Most of my subordinates are 15 to 20 years younger and a few are even more than 20. There's one of them who annoys me but other NCO's Soldiers do. I don't get it. It's like I don't like other people's kids but my own. The bonding seems easy. Young people seen clingy and sensitive. I have witnessed them bonding with other though. They do it by partaking in festivities involving large amounts of alcohol.
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Cpl Tom Surdi
They are young and dumb, just getting out on their own. I am far more mellow now than I was when I was active duty, and I would never partake in the bonding ritual I mentioned now. Times change, it's been over 15 years since I was in, and it's not the same Marine Corps that I know. I think part of the problem with this newer generation is that their parents pandered to them and made excuses for them when they messed up, so it's harder to instill discipline in them and they tend to find different ways to bond. But I am also sure that generations before me said the same thing about us.
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When you single out one or a few individuals or you isolate them then usually that is hazing. If everyone is partaking of the same misery then that is bonding. Bonding happens everyone goes through the same or similar ordeal. I had one BN commander who thought the best way to raise morale he would make us do 12 mile ruck march.
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