Posted on Apr 7, 2015
CSM Michael J. Uhlig
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Is this a case of parental neglect?

How does the mom not know how her seven kids are living.....but ready to drop everything after they died to claim she would have helped them live?

Does the power company share responsibility in the deaths of this family?

Is the father solely responsible for the deaths of himself and his children?

Is welfare to blame for the deaths because they did not give the family enough to pay their bills?

Are both parents responsible, after all, they had more children than they could afford to support. right?

Terrible that everyone wants to help AFTER THE FACT! What are your thoughts?

http://news.yahoo.com/utility-removed-stolen-electric-meter-8-were-poisoned-195913163.html
Edited 9 y ago
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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This is a tragic situation, where several mistakes were made, but the children are dead because the father didn't know about the dangers of Carbon Monoxide.
Woulda, coulda, shoulda has no bearing here.
I'm quite sure mom wishes she would have done something differently. Undoubtedly, there is a reason dad had sole custody. She will have to live with the results of her decisions.
But she gets to live.

Sometimes life is unfair.
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1SG Civil Affairs Specialist
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Quote of the Story:

"Todd had a troubled history with the law, including a number of alleged altercations with his now ex-wife, court records show. In 2011, he was accused of stabbing Chambers in the face. The following year, he was convicted of second-degree assault and spent a year in jail and 18 months on probation. His ex-wife could not be reached for comment Tuesday.

“He had an anger problem,” said Angela Collins, a family friend. “But he was all about taking care of his kids.”

How does someone with this history get custody out of foster care?!

Further, what were the circumstances that led to foster care being better than living with mom, and living with dad after that kind of history is better than either?

I sense that there is a lot more to the story. I'll wager it comes out that mommy had some issues too.
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Capt Logistics Readiness Officer (LRO)
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I'm with you 1SG (Join to see), there's way more to this story than what's being stated. Another person the finger is not being aimed at is the landlord, who never had legal power hooked up to the house. Not sure how that is legal for a rental property, period. Also, does this state not require CO2 alarms? I know they're required by law out here.
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CW2 Joseph Evans
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Every so often, events conspire to create the perfect storm. This is tragic, but there was no one single event that killed this family beyond the ignorance of the father running a gas generator inside his house.
The power company was simply complying with regulations and could not know who was dependent on the power provided by the meter.
Welfare can not help people that do not come to them for help.
The ex-wife was overwhelmed. She could pay the child support, but if she didn't know where to send the checks, there isn't much that can be done.
Don't get me started on "Family Planning" in America...
The father was coping relatively well despite the stolen power situations. The family was making it, until he turned on a generator in the house and put everyone to sleep... forever.

This sucks, but no one here had any intention of creating a situation like this, and there were many other things that could have happened to prevent it, but none of them did.
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Capt Retired
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I did not vote as I do not see an option that is appropriate to this. So much wrong here. And so many unanswered questions.

For all those who are involved my deepest sympathy.
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Ethical dilemma here - pointing fingers, blame goes around but nobody responsible - how?
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
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Edited 9 y ago
There is no blame to be had. This was an unfortunate incident.

Let's look at the sequence of events:

Parents are divorced, and it appears the family (Father & Children) move several times. Mother was paying child support until she lost them in one of the moves. The location they moved into has "inactive" electricity (sounds like the meter was never disconnected). They use electricity until the error is noted, and the power company removes a meter that should not be there. Father acquires generator to provide power for the house. Family dies 3 days later from CO poisoning.

This was not a monetary issue. The power wasn't disconnected because of non-payment, therefore let's take blame away from the Child Support & Welfare points. Additionally, the power company had no way of knowing there was a family living there. They merely reclaiming what was essentially an abandoned item.

That leaves the father (and possibly who he rented the property from). After power was shut off, he took immediate action by buying a generator to keep his family warm.

Based on that, he made a mistake in bringing the generator inside, but I have a hard time ethically throwing blame at him for that mistake. He was trying to do right, and made a mistake.

Ethically, what mistake was made? I can't see one. All I see is an unfortunate accident.
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PV2 Senior Web Designer, Web Team Lead
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Very well stated
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
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"Based on that, he made a mistake in bringing the generator inside, but I have a hard time ethically throwing blame at him for that mistake. He was trying to do right, and made a mistake. "

I can blame him it is a common knowledge item to not run engines indoors and they are labeled as such.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
9 y
TSgt Joshua Copeland Right, but that isn't an Ethical mistake, it's one of knowledge.

The framing of the question hinges on a discussion of Right/Wrong, not Knowledge/Ignorance.

Just like things can be Legal, but Unethical, things can be Ethical, but badly planned.
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
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I file this one clearly under unethical, because of how routine the knowledge is, and the warning labels, the father intentionally placed his children in danger.
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CW5 Desk Officer
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First of all, this is a tragic event. Extremely sad. Tragic.

I didn't vote, CSM Michael J. Uhlig, because I would like to see an option for failure on the part of the father, the mother, the utility company, neighbors, friends, various government agencies, and "the system."

I don't think the power company is solely or even primarily to blame. I do think they're defending themselves on a technicality, but I doubt they have the personnel to investigate every time somebody steals electricity or doesn't pay their bill. They have procedures in place to address those situations, and when those situations arise, the procedures kick in.

With all the money that our government "throws around" at others, you would think there would be some for a man raising seven children. Was it ignorance on his part? Did he not have the time to investigate what was available to him because he was working? And I ask that in all seriousness, because if he had taken the route that many take - fully relying on the government and not bothering to work - he and his kids might be alive today.

An extremely sad episode. I submit that the system failed this man. His family failed him. His neighbors failed him. His wife failed him. And he failed his children and himself.
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SGT Richard H.
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Edited 9 y ago
I went with both parents being responsible. I don't know much about the situation other than what is mentioned here in the article, and I've learned over time that having ALL the facts is rarely a prerequisite on the journalist's part to the actual publishing of any article....but with that being said, both parents share a burden for the well being of their children and whether or not they live in the same household is pretty much irrelevant (until said responsibility is relieved by the state, which may have been the better option here).
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MSG Brad Sand
MSG Brad Sand
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Today, journalist do not care about any facts...facts get in the way of telling their stories.
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SPC Angel Guma
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CSM-

Respectfully, both are to blame. Its the biggest crime against humanity when children suffer and die because their parents have no moral responsibility. To me, this is as barbaric a crime against humanity as anything the Gestapo did. Don't have so many kids if you can't properly take care of them!
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MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca
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If you are married you raise a family together - you make decisions together and look out for the welfare of your children together, we all fall on tough times and municipalities and utility companies don't have sympathy for individual stories. This is a truly tragic and completely avoidable disaster.
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Cpl Jeff N.
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It is a tragedy for sure but it is not an accident. There is a long list of bad decisions made by the father and mother that finally cost the children (and the father) their lives.

It starts with a bad marriage (bad decision) then there is an assault and prison time (bad decision) then 7 children (bad decision likely based upon ability to take care of them). A divorce (she had little choice considering his violence toward her). She does not keep track of her kids (bad decision).

The power company said the meter was stolen (bad decision if he was stealing power). He put a generator in the house (bad decision).

He might have been a good Dad doing the best he could so I am not judging his motives or intentions only the reality that this was a long line of decisions and actions that lead to the outcome.

If you root cause this and start asking the whys, where I ended up pretty quickly was the stolen power meter. What I don't is why they had a stolen power meter. Was it no money to pay the bill, was he trying to cut corners, I don't know but suspect it was a money issue. Why he didn't apply for funding he appeared to be able to get is still a mystery too.

8 people are tragically dead.
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SSG Healthcare Specialist (Combat Medic)
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This is all too common. Today people feel entitled and not accountable. Having kids takes two, if you're going to pop them as much as a popcorn machine pops corn in any given movie night and expect society to pick up the tab then be prepared for hardship. It's no accident. People want instant gratification, and it truly had hardened my stance on empathy. That is just lacking in morals, congratulation on taking God out of our schools and glorifying Hollywood. I'm sorry for the children they're the only victims here, and nature just took its course, survival of the fittest. I know some of you will disapprove, but there's point where were you are held accountable. I am. All the troubles I get for stupid stuff I've done, I have owned them. Even when I'm down, I clean up dust off count my blessings and move in, just Charlie Mike
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