Have the women with combat jobs in the Rangers and Special Forces actually been fighting along side men?

SFC Eric Harmon - Are you bored? Get a hobby besides trolling people online. Lol. It's lame.

Not your sweetie.

I don't have a short attention span - I just don't care about things that I commented on a year and a half ago.

"Your kind?" What the f* does that mean? I have no clue who you are, I am not going to sift through posts from a year and a half ago to stroke your ego so...yeah.

Is this all retired military men do? Troll on military forums? Because yikes...when I retire I definitely will not be spending an inordinate amount of time on this page like some of you all do. Go live life man.

SFC (Join to see) - You know it comes to your inbox, so no, not some random trolling. Your kind is the hard left, the kind that are tearing the nation apart. Ego? You have absolutely no effect on an ego. You made an asinine post that I called out. You seem to have a problem with it.

Dude! great job MSG.

Good points. Women can help men and fight with men but they can't do everything a man can do or be a man. Women will most likely loose 1:1 fights with men but they can outsmart them to win.

INVENT SOME MEMORY PILLS,SO WE CAN REMEMBER. L0OL

They were treated differently than I was. I went to the last hard class of Ranger School

SPC Bill Bailey They were treated differently. Women have special needs that men do not.

SFC Samuel Morgan - thanks for your comments.

COL Ralph Bryan Hanes - still does not change the fact they were not carrying around 60 lb rucksacks now does it sir?

CW3 Debra Irby - The Comanches and other plains warrior tribes belioeved women were there to support the warrior male.

We’re talking about rt now! No life lost for doing the duty of protecting women for a social experiment.

It's not that women don't belong in combat, it's their need to break the barriers that exist like SF training. Men have different muscular and physiological differences

I am sure those serving in these types of units aren't actively trying to broadcast their service. I had a opportunity to speak to one of the first female graduates of Ranger school. She did not like the attention, and would have much rather been the quiet professional that attracted her to the profession in the first place. Same with the female Sapper graduates. They want to do their jobs and don't need articles published showing they are successful. They want their OER/NCOER to speak for itself and move along with their career.

We all run into professionals every day, and never once question their ability, until they show they cannot. Then it is up to us, as senior leaders, to put the right people in the right place at the right point in their career.

I would presume that the negative reaction seen in this thread is because the question continually comes up in the context that females have to demonstrate their value to this organization in order to be treated as a Soldier.

glad you served alongside women in your units....but as the question was asked...was that a Ranger or Special Forces unit they were serving in along with you or are you comparing apples and oranges here?

TSgt James Sutton -
No, not SF of Ranger Bats.
3 in support roles in two different infantry companies. One supply, 2 admins. Where I might not have cared for one of them, I felt very comfortable with them having to cover their side jobs: security, convoys, training, etc. One was also the police liaison for counter-drug enforcement activities. One deployed with our infantry company for peace keeping operations. One of the first females to do so. Professional, capable and competent.
I also worked with multiple females it a training support batallion and in the medical field. Many medics, MP's, among other MOS's.
As an instructor I was able to observe many female soldiers in training environments and felt comfortable with most of them and their abilities.
The ones I had issues with, were the same types of issues I saw with male soldiers. Not willing to listen, egos, physical and mental capabilities.
The only real issues I had were the guys playing hero, trying to get "favors"/attention from the females, and of course the females who prey on them. There have been many times (not as rare as you would think) males and females who couldn't keep their hands off of each other, instead of paying attention to their tasks and sectors.
In fact, nothing new for the military environment.

Overall, I feel comfortable with women in these roles. If they can complete their training, pull their weight, competently fill a role, be willing to take the risk and stay out of trouble, I see no reason for them to not be there. Operations in the middle east, and other parts of the world, have proven that there is a need.

nobody wants to get in trouble

SSgt Christophe Murphy - exactly, adn well put Sarge.

I personally know a number of women in tank crews. In every position from loader to TC, enlisted, non com and Officer. They love what they do and don't ask for any help outside of training needs. I've been very impressed with them, their drive and determination to succeed and prove themselves as tankers, not women tankers, TANKERS. I don't give a flying fuck about sex, if you can do the job w/o killing your team/crew mate you should be given the chance. If not, you should be given another MOS, PERIOD !

you are attempting to minimize what was asked.....yes women have served in combat "units" and gone thru some extreme training, but none, as others have stated really have served in frontline Ranger and Special Forces units....they may have gotten thru "amended" training protocols with extra tries and increased nutrition compared to men but they really haven't done the same standards as men.

TSgt James Sutton I wasn’t minimizing anything. I was just providing some information and context in regards to women in combat.I also accompanied my post with questions to better understand the original question in case what I provided missed the mark

TSgt James Sutton

You think ppl in supply can't be in situations in which they may face the enemy in combat? Of course they can. Let me help you figure out what she was saying. Ms. Hotard was responding to the OP and the idea that women in combat situations might be merely "for show" and "can't handle combat." She gave an example based on her experience. And you come back with "That's the best you got?"

SrA Gina Hotard

I don't know if he's "hateful." He sure does sound like an idiot, tho.

Sgt Osla McKercher I appreciate your response!!

SrA Gina Hotard

I changed my mind about Sutton after seeing some of his other responses. I don't think he's a very nice person. At any rate, good on you for standing your ground.

SSG Bill McCoy - Considering I can see men on this thread who think exactly like that - it's not just a civilian mindset.

SFC (Join to see) - Sarge, there are certainly women, and certian women who can do what many/most men can. My comments aren't made to denegrate or lessen womens contribution to the mission, military or civilian. Just like men, there are good/bad, weak/strong. If all things were equal, physical tests would not differ.
We had our MP reunion at Ft. Leonard Wood a few years ago and I must say, I was totally impressed with the female DS'. They didn't pull any punches in differentiating between males and females so there is hope. Just as I don't believe a weaker male should be in a combat unit (or a fire fighter, police officer, etc), women should not be an exception for purposes of "equity," or "diversity." We've seem to have lost the EQUAL mindset.

again another poster ignoring the question....are those units you see and serve with women Ranger and other Special Forces units....not did the women pass "amended" training courses....but did they then go on to serve on the frontlines along with other Rangers and Special Forces....if you haven't seen that.....then your response is invalid, the question wasn't do women serve in regular army units...but do they also serve in Special Forces units as well or do they move on to other areas instead?

TSgt James Sutton - Oh look another person posting on old threads...and no one ignored the question. It was answered.
One woman is a Naval Special Warfare Operator - in 2021. The first woman made it into the Green Berets in 2020. The first one to be allowed a Green Beret. The first woman to actually complete the Army’s Special Forces Qualification Course was then CPT Kathleen Wilder in 1980 but was not permitted to graduate on time because she filed a sex discrimination complaint - and the Army determined she had wrongly been denied graduation. She was allowed to wear the SF tab when it was created in 1983 and did over her 28 year career.

As of this year, 100 women have graduated Ranger school since the first so I would bet yes they are going on any missions. Are you going to hear about them? No - none of us will. We shouldn't be.

Let's also acknowledge the fact politics and pressure are sabotaging women in special operations in all branches. For example - in early Mar 2020 military. com announced a female had been selected for Special Tactics "an elite AF organization that conducts challenging missions in some of the most dangerous parts of the world." Then earlier this year someone posted on IG an anonymous letter claiming that the Special Tactics schoolhouse had given preferential treatment to the woman. AFSOC said no standards were changed and then it comes out that it was all a communication failure led by other students who simply BELIEVED PT standards had been lowered. They had no proof. They just thought it had been. That seems to be the common trend of any woman who tries to go special operations. Someone tries to sabotage it. Whether politicians or disgruntled toxic men.

MSG Thomas Currie - Good point, but Infantry wasn't closed to women for physical reasons. The gentlemen thought that they (females) would be a distraction:
1. Civilians weren't equipped to handle our "daughters" dying;
2. Male Soldiers would be distracted by females in training, reducing readiness;
3. Male Soldiers would be distracted by injured females as they would rush to save them;
4. Male Soldiers could not handle dead females on the battlefield.

These thoughts permeated our thinking and made anti-female infantry taboo to an extent that they are the true premise behind the "physicality" argument.

CSM William Everroad - You forgot #5 Infantry barracks didn't have bath tubs which were required by regulation for female barracks.

You can rationalize why women were kept out of direct combat in the US Army (all the reasons you list are true -- and they were also completely valid at that time and are still largely valid today).

The simple fact is that contrary to modern woke nonsense, men and women are different -- physically, mentally, and emotionally. There are certainly some PEOPLE (both sexes) who are far outside the norm, but policies are generally developed to fit the average.

Women have NEVER been treated equally in the US Army -- whether the net differences have been a detriment or an advantage is open to debate.

There was a time when questioning the ban on women in combat was unacceptable. Today asking whether women are actually serving in those roles on an equal basis with their peers is apparently unacceptable [As clearly evidenced by the hostile reactions here, and the fact that none of the replies ever even considered answering the original poster's question]

Well put, and spot on! In fact, in today's Army, questioning any aspect of womens fitness in combat typically results in counselling identifying an NCO or Officer as a "Toxic Leader," despite many questions being valid.

Well to be true you completely ignored the question he asked...you compared your infantry unit to the Rangers and Special Forces units? Are you in either and have you had women serve with you in the Rangers or Special Forces? If not, then your response is invalid, who cares if women served in infantry units? That wasn't the question asked....so either answer the question or move along.

so you believe, HONESTLY believe that females can carry a 60 lb rucksack like a male can and be equally combat ready after a days hike and be able to fight the enemy? You really believe that?

Abso******lutly. Seen it hundreds of times in the MP Corp.