Posted on Jun 7, 2021
How often do Officers leave the military as O-2s?
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I'm looking down the barrel of another deployment (I'm looking forward to it). During my last IDT, the SXO approached me and asked if I was planning on staying in or leaving. I'm looking to move to Florida upon our return from this deployment and by the time we get backed I'll have 8 years in. Balancing life as an Officer in the Army (National Guard) and a Police Officer is quite the challenge. Add a family on the way and it's rather daunting. I could have promoted a couple years ago but found out that my current unit (in 2018) was possibly deploying to Afghanistan and I REALLY wanted to go as a PL (since my time as a PL was rather checkered). That mission got scrapped so I'm going where we are going now as the Troop XO. It dawned on me that a good part of me doesn't care about making Captain. My evals have always been good and I've always performed well at PT. But the way the SXO and a few other Officers talked about it made me wonder...is it considered bad if an Officer leaves the military as an O-2? I was curious what anyone here, Active, Guard, or Reserves thought.
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Responses: 135
An old 1SG's take- "F*** 'em, do what is right for you."
You've paid your dues, you have nothing to feel bad about.
You've paid your dues, you have nothing to feel bad about.
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LT Leon Heselton
Whatever you decide, don't give up on a reserve career.
1stSgt Ronald Sheps
Steven, you said right, brother!
1LT (Join to see)
I left at O2 and went back to school, best decision I ever made
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All I wanted to do was get to O-2, but the army wouldnt even do that. Now I need to sue to get them to change their minds. Stupid Army.
The first ever OCS candidate I ever recruited into the Army left service as a 19A 1LT. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it, as long as you at least fulfilled your contractual obligation to the Army after receiving your commission. Granted, it would be highly unusual and uncharacteristic to RETIRE as an O-2, that would certainly raise some eyebrows and invite questions. While it is true that officers generally make CPT before leaving the Army, your situation isn't as uncommon as you may think. Besides, billeting and vacancies in the ARNG are a whole different animal than Active Duty anyway. No one bats an eye when an Enlisted servicemember leaves the ARNG after 20 years as a SPC or SGT, so why would it look bad for you to exit service as a 1LT with eight years?
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That is exactly what I was thinking. If I met someone that retired as a 1LT, I'd "wonder", but if they mentioned they were NG, I would think "OK, that makes sense".
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The ARNG is just a different animal altogether. You do you first because in twenty years is the ARNG going to be beside you rubbing your aching back or is the ARNG going to even care...? The only ones who WILL care are the family members who are still around (HH6), so it stinks to throw away eight years of HARD work and investment but it is what it is...being ARNG though, go to FL and find a slot you want at a unit you want to be with, enough said.
All the ones I knew were previous enlisted but most left as Captains, suppose it depends on how many years you have until you hit 20 when u ou are commissioned.
MSG James Bronson
I can't believe there are Majors and First Sergeants answering the way they have. What happened to Unit loyalty? Of course, I retired over 30 years ago when we had "Up or Out". What happened to that program?
Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen
MSG James Bronson I think it still exists but I'm the same as you except only 28 years.
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
One of My friend actually was a MSgt and had to get an age waiver to be commissioned as a 2Lt. When He made major I made SMSgt and We were both promoted in the same ceremony and He thought that would be a far as He went but actually was able to advance to and retire later as a Full Colonel, (06) Another friend and My Squadron Commander for a while before a PCS move went from SSgt to 2Lt and advanced further and also retired as a Full Colonel. One interesting thing in that unit ALL our Officers ere prior enlisted and all had been NCO's, SSgt, TSgt and even a MSgt. Some of the others I lost track of so don't know where their Military careers went but knowing them I'm sure it was good. Another Officer, same last name as Me McCarter, (not related though) was a TSgt became a 2Lt and advanced all the way to Full Colonel also and it was easy to see why , He was an excellent Officer a good man who did achieve any goal He set out for.
Myself I kind of regret I turned down an opportunity to become commissioned at one point even though another Commander, OIC and even the Base equal Opportunity Officer tried to talk Me into into, being a young SSgt at the time though i thought I knew more than i actually did but it was still a good Military career. They wanted Me to go on what was then called "Operation Bootstrap" where if You have two years of college which i did then, the USAF would send Me full time to the remaining two years then to OCS to become a 2Lt. After 8 years active duty I did get out and became a full time student and received My BS degree. After and 8 year break I did go back into an Air Force Uniform as a SSgt (lost the four years time in grade due to the length of the break) I did advance quickly though and spent the last 4 years as a SMSgt and turned down CMSgt to retire. I did serve for 14 more years and retired with 22 years total service. I also retired from a civilian Police Department so collect retirment pay from both the USAF and the Police Department.
Myself I kind of regret I turned down an opportunity to become commissioned at one point even though another Commander, OIC and even the Base equal Opportunity Officer tried to talk Me into into, being a young SSgt at the time though i thought I knew more than i actually did but it was still a good Military career. They wanted Me to go on what was then called "Operation Bootstrap" where if You have two years of college which i did then, the USAF would send Me full time to the remaining two years then to OCS to become a 2Lt. After 8 years active duty I did get out and became a full time student and received My BS degree. After and 8 year break I did go back into an Air Force Uniform as a SSgt (lost the four years time in grade due to the length of the break) I did advance quickly though and spent the last 4 years as a SMSgt and turned down CMSgt to retire. I did serve for 14 more years and retired with 22 years total service. I also retired from a civilian Police Department so collect retirment pay from both the USAF and the Police Department.
Honestly, if you're getting out what difference does it make? You probably won't even talk to half of the people you're serving with anyway. Like someone said already in the comments and that is to do whats best for you and your family.
If you resign your commission and do not retire, you will be a former 1LT no different than a former specialist or private. The only important thing is your veteran's status and deployment history. Have you achieved what you want to achieve? A family and career in LE is more important to you now, well chances are you are still young and in a few more years time in the National Guard may be more feasible. A lot of people focus on their family life when the children are very young and I think that is a bad idea. When I was doing the things I needed to do to make major, my kids were 1-3 years old and they did not miss me. Now my son is 11 and I have coached his wrestling team for four years and this is my first year doing baseball. I just retired and I can guarantee what is important to your kids is being there when they can remember you being there and being gone when they won't remember. My wife had some tough times when I was gone and the kids were little but we survived and my children will remember my times coaching them verses Mommy being a single parent when they were in diapers.
A lot of people, especially officers, think to be anything you must take it to retirement. That is BS. It is your life, your family, and those will likely be the only things around in 20-40 years to give a shit. People that think you need to take this to retirement will be long gone, especially if they are senior to you. Only difference between you and I is I get almost free healthcare until death along with $4100 before taxes every month.
A lot of people, especially officers, think to be anything you must take it to retirement. That is BS. It is your life, your family, and those will likely be the only things around in 20-40 years to give a shit. People that think you need to take this to retirement will be long gone, especially if they are senior to you. Only difference between you and I is I get almost free healthcare until death along with $4100 before taxes every month.
CPT (Join to see)
I think differently than that, after back to back deployments my youngest two children had zero idea who I was...ANY TIME without children is time you will never get back, EVER. If you have zero ambition as a family man, then great but you can't ever get back lost time. Remember that what is precious to you might not be what is precious to your family.
I left active duty as an O-2. I had declined promotion twice in combat because I wanted to return to my civilian job with AF Intelligence. If I had accepted promotion, it would have added 12 months to my tour in Vietnam. I had already been there for six months and I had promised the family that I would get out of there as soon as possible. So it was an easy decision.
If you did your time honorably I don't think it looks bad. Keep a good attitude and tell them you want to focus on your civilian job and family.
I think that to anyone who doesn't know shit about themilitary, they won't care.
For those who DO know, however, getting out as an O2 will certainly raise a few eyebrows. That being said, when you see the raised eyebrows, just smile a knowing smile that shows you know a little secret and wouldn't THEY like to know? Then walk away and leave 'em wondering.
For those who DO know, however, getting out as an O2 will certainly raise a few eyebrows. That being said, when you see the raised eyebrows, just smile a knowing smile that shows you know a little secret and wouldn't THEY like to know? Then walk away and leave 'em wondering.
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I never thought about it that way...thank you, SFC!!
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1LT Wes Mincin - Honestly, if we were to cross paths I would merely presume you were NG. It's when you get out at a 2LT I think raises legit questions.
Because honestly, I just made CPT last FY, and I was on the fence about even bothering with submitting a package for it and just entering IRR as a 1LT and being done with it. So I would have been in the same boat. By time USAR officers near CPT they all enter their IRR window and it's not uncommon.
Because honestly, I just made CPT last FY, and I was on the fence about even bothering with submitting a package for it and just entering IRR as a 1LT and being done with it. So I would have been in the same boat. By time USAR officers near CPT they all enter their IRR window and it's not uncommon.
The only thing unusual about it is that most O-2 won't have finished their MSO or their Active Duty Service Obligation, which is why you see a lot of Captains getting out after they hit staff time.
I will tell you that you will remember you Company Command time as the high point in your career. My two favorite positions in the Army/Army National Guard were Engineer Company Commander and Assistant Brigade Engineer.
Staff time after command is what you make of it. The job of S-1 is not exciting, but at least 75% of the questions I respond to here come from that experience.
I got out just as I was coming up on promotion to Major because of some family issues that I thought my full time present could mitigate. Hindsight says it didn't matter at all.
I will tell you that you will remember you Company Command time as the high point in your career. My two favorite positions in the Army/Army National Guard were Engineer Company Commander and Assistant Brigade Engineer.
Staff time after command is what you make of it. The job of S-1 is not exciting, but at least 75% of the questions I respond to here come from that experience.
I got out just as I was coming up on promotion to Major because of some family issues that I thought my full time present could mitigate. Hindsight says it didn't matter at all.
In the grand scheme of things, does it really matter to you? Will it matter in 20 years? If you feel you won't be fulfilled if you don't make O-3, then great, go for it. If you are just worried that someone may look down on you for not making O-3 but you don't really want to, well as 1SG Steven Imerman so, eloquently put it, "F*** 'em, do what is right for you."
Life is too short to do things you don't like simply to make someone else happy.
Life is too short to do things you don't like simply to make someone else happy.
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