Posted on Oct 16, 2016
How would you react to an E2 who "smart mouths" you in formation?
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Here's the background. You're a senior E5. Your troops are in formation and you're handing out work for the day. You hand out an assignment to a fresh E2 with less than a year in and only a few months at your command. They blatantly complain and tell you to choose someone else. You calmly tell them they will do this task and they tell you to shove it and give it to someone else. How do you react?
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 3697
Couple of things. " End state is the PFC will comply, the senior NCO should maintain his or her military discipline, composure, and professional bearing while providing the proper motivation. Upon completion of the PFC's task, NJP is warranted for insubordination, unprofessional conduct and conduct unbecoming. Since PFC thinks he belongs to some good old boys club and not a member of a team, some remediation training is in order. Some relationship building will be in order to establish authority. In the end it is the E-5's responsibility to ensure that after the dust is settled that he is someone the PFC can go to for essential needs ... ( equipment, training, answers to questions).
We may not like who works for us or who we work for but our mission and objectives are the same. Sometimes new members of the military need a reminder that when bootcamp , and MOS school ends , their responsibilities, jobs, service and careers begin.
We may not like who works for us or who we work for but our mission and objectives are the same. Sometimes new members of the military need a reminder that when bootcamp , and MOS school ends , their responsibilities, jobs, service and careers begin.
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"The dismembered, unidentifiable corps of an E2 was found floating at sea today by a fishing vessel. The metal rank insignia was the only unchared piece of uniform left on the body. Investigators believe he smarted of to the wrong NCO."
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Set this young man straight immediately and remind him that this is not "His Show"
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Have him and his battle buddy/ roommate/ or the most squared away PFC in the squad meet me in 5 minutes in bdu's and L.B.E. Explain his buddy (the squared away pfc) just got shot because of his (shithead's) refusal to follow orders and his failure to "shoot, move and communicate" (or do what needs done). Low crawl buddy drag around the batallion until all work details are complete, which will take longer because of 2 less workers. Hot or cold, rain or shine this one drives the message home without ever raising your voice. Then paper counseling. Always leave a paper trail or of there is a next time it's like it never happened and Article 15 is harder.
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As a civilian who comes from a military family, in fact I'm the first out of the last 4, and maybe even more, generations of my family to not join the NAVY. But as the son of an E7 Chief Petty Officer, Ive spent enough growing up on Coronado to know that it is never ok to disobey a direct order from a superior and good things will never come to anyone who thinks it is ok to do so. I don't know much more about the military and the way they do things than what I learned on living on base, but I do know that the last thing anyone would ever want to do if they appreciate whatever privileges they may have is to tell my father (NAVY E7 CPO)(that's Chief Petty Officer for those unfamiliar with rank)absolutely anything he wouldn't be happy to hear let alone disobey a direct order from someone who not only has been walking around the block 10 years for every year the disobedient kid, with obviously no respect, think he's been around the block. But for the most part, obviously there's exceptions as there are with anything but, for example, in the case of my father your not just telling someone who's been serving for the entirety of your naive life to F off, your telling a man, not an adult male of at least 18 years who calls them self a man, but a real man (yes there's a difference) who has more than proven himself not only as a man but as a soldier and not even just a soldier but as a man the way man should be defined...Someone who would selflessly and without question fight and die to protect not only what they believe in, not only their family, but to protect the rights in which we take for granted on a daily basis and to protect the families of everyone in this great country of ours, foriegn and domestic. Your telling a man who again, didn't just earn the title Man, your telling a man who busted his ass to get where he is and has more than earned much more respect you are expected to show... Your telling someone who has (I would hope so anyways if you wish to be Considered a leader of any kind) seen combat On more than one occasion that his orders aren't worth following and you never know, that superior you just might as well have said F U too could and without warning start having a post traumatic episode and it might just be the one where the drill instructor spit in his ear. Kids these days aren't Taught to respect and obey like they were generations before my own and it reflects in our young ones. Everyone has their own opinion on how a situation such as this should be handled...As a 24 Year old kid (notice I didn't refer to myself as a man, only cause I believe the title Man should be exclusively reserved for people like our men and women who so bravely fight to protect our way of living and do so with the expectation of nothing in return) and as an American citizen who has had the pleasure of being part of the worst generation to ever walk the planet. Ive been Blessed with the opportunity to observe the way this great country of mine has evolved over the years and how the way people act and the things people do have also changed weather it's do to immigration and the cultural diversity that is America or maybe it's just the age we live in, I may not know how things really were before my days but I know enough to know that this country isnt what it used to be. We were once a nation united, especially back in the 40s 50s and weve slowly become a nation divided over time. Divided by race, and culture and so much more...All it takes is a little change. Take the time to discipline your children properly....It'll make all the difference in the future...
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Do push ups, then give him latrine Duty with a toothbrush. Since he likes to talk crap let him clean it up.
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Example needs to be made, teach them discipline now and it just may save his life or the lives of his fellow soldiers in the future
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In the military there is a chain of command, as in this scenario I would be an Sgt or Second Class Petty Officer I would do the following. So I would hand out the assignments and have a conversation the private or seaman's NCO or Petty Officer supervisor in private. They would be told to have a conversation with the individual and report back when the problem is corrected. The private or seaman would be assigned to every shit detail that crossed my desk. If the NCO {E-4} or Petty Officer {E-4} could not correct the problem in what I think is a timely manor then they would start to do his details and he would watch them until they corrected the problem. As I was keeping a long as to what I did to correct the problem complete with dates and time. If the problem persisted, I would fill out the proper forms to refer charges when I have a conversation with my supervisor. After I have a conversation with my supervisor it would be his responsibility to correct and or advise me as to the next course of action.
In the old days we would have a NCO party with all of the units NCO's and the private or seaman as the center of attention. That would leave him with no witness and his word against twenty E-4 to E-9's.
In the old days we would have a NCO party with all of the units NCO's and the private or seaman as the center of attention. That would leave him with no witness and his word against twenty E-4 to E-9's.
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I agree with all. It needs to be nipped at the initial standpoint! You let them know who'is in charge! You establish the leadership organization at the beginning!
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Completely unacceptable. Smoke him until he has an attitude adjustment. Then hand him his assignment for the day. His response should be, Yes Sergeant! Thank You Sergeant!
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I would have the rest of the troops go to their assigned jobs and keep the young E-2 behind. Then I would take the young troop somewhere where we could talk in private. I would explain how it works to him again and if he still acts the same, I would pencil whip him and explain to him what I was doing and that it could cost him his stripes and money. If that didn't impress him, then it would be all over and I wouldn't have anything more to do with him other than the fact that he was going to see the old man and he could expect to be kicked out of my Army.
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