Posted on Jun 12, 2019
SPC(P) Medical Laboratory Specialist
772K
9.33K
2.84K
1.8K
1.8K
4
We have a new 1SG and new commander. The 1SG noticed one day that only 5 people in the whole company showed up to PT. Now he put out to all the platoon Sergeants that everyone must show up to PT at either the 0530 formation or the 1600 formation.

However, my section is the only one in the hospital that has a 1600-0000 shift. I am being told by my first line that the 1SG says that I have to be at the morning formation, no exceptions.

I don’t want to sound like I’m whining but at the same time it’s unfortunate that I have to explain to myself as to why this isn’t right.

As a junior enlisted I do feel stuck.

How do I bring this issue up and solve this effectively and professionally?
Also: Do you know of any Army Regulations that can support anything?
Edited 6 y ago
Avatar feed
Responses: 1688
Votes
  • Newest
  • Oldest
  • Votes
TSgt Robert Wayne
0
0
0
All I'm hearing is you have a problem with authority always looking for a way out and can't be trusted by your team mates if you get deployed to a hots spot like Kuwait. Go to PT!
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
M Nob
0
0
0
Ummm.... I live my life on 5 hours of sleep...
What are you going to do when you’re up all night with a sick kid? Are you going to tell your boss you can’t get your job done? Are you kidding? Get with the program. Figure it out! You sound like a snowflake!
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSG Steve Jackson
0
0
0
Hey this is Military Life, I get it but again this is military life. If you really want to brake it down you can sleep the 4 to 5 hours before PT then eat and go back to bed and that will give you at least 7 hours sleep. Your hours don't give you that night time play but you do have choices
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SPC Brian Pritchard/Hall
0
0
0
Suck it up. Go take shower and go back to bed.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Sgt Ivan Boatwright
0
0
0
In Nam sometimes we would get only two hours of sleep and an alert would sound and then no more that night. Sometimes you sleep two and two off and then go fill sandbags, go on patrol, or whatever with no rest during the day. You could hump the boonies all night and then work or fight the next day. Bootcamp should have taught you that you can do more on less than you think you need. That means, less food, less water, dirty clothes, and no bath unless it rains. Accept and expect those facts or get a discharge before combat. After this week it may be very close and deadly. I think it was Tet of 68 when a nurse I grew up with was in Tokyo hospital and she told me later when we were both out that she went on duty one day and the wounded were flying in by chopper one after another after arriving in Japan that the rooms filled as well as the halls. The nurses were on 24-hour shifts. She was exhausted when a person on a table at night asked her to wipe his face, she almost said something nasty but stopped herself and saw he had no arms. She went into a room and cried. Her name was Bonnie Watson. Yes, she is real and she survived but was burned out by the pain, suffering, and stupidity of war. War is for the young stupid men who do not question to fight for the rich and powerful to profit from.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
PO1 Dell Hart
0
0
0
Suck it up or get out. Quit being a whiner.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CPL Joseph Elinger
0
0
0
It's PT, not a PT Test dude! Come on! Seriously, on occasion we'd come in drunk from the evening & straight to PT. I was 23 & didn't puke, some of the young ones did.
Considering your duty shift, if your NCOIC wanted to, the whole shift could do PT together right after duty. PT is a mutual obligation your branch shares with you to meet consistent fitness. Think it out, is it important enough to you & your shift persons to request? If do, approach the NCOIC through Chain of Command. It's a valid request, for a valid consideration, to a valid solution. If requested properly, it will be seriously considered.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGT John Pearson
0
0
0
I really liked my time in the Army, with one exception, lack of sleep. It wasn't just me, it was my company in general. We got pretty good at taking power naps when we could. When I became an NCO it could be even worse at times. I remember being up for 36 hours straight once during a field exercise. Learn to be creative if you can't work something out with command.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CSM Ralph Hernandez
0
0
0
Suck it up and drive on. When you will get even less! Good training!
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CSM Information Operations Planner
0
0
0
The fact that something can be done, or has been done a certain way in the past, is a poor reason to do it going forward. It is certainly a potentially relevant factor, but does not suffice as a sole criterion to justify a policy.

For better or for worse (and it seems there are a lot of those on this forum who would consider it for worse), the Army has recognized that maximizing human performance requires changing some of its practices. To this end, the Army as an institution and profession is promoting what it calls the "Performance Triad" which includes adequate sleep as one of three essential elements for maximizing performance.

Can we "suck it up" to get through a mission, operation, surge shift at the hospital, or whatever? Sure! But evidence-based research demonstrates that sleep deprivation, especially over prolonged periods, leads to sub-optimal decision-making and that leads to sub-optimal performance.

the leadership of a medical unit should know this better than any other kind of unit, as the Performance Triad is heavily promoted by the Army Medical Department. See, for instance, https://p3.amedd.army.mil/performance-learning-center/sleep, a resource that can help identify factors that lead to sleep deprivation and educate leaders on the possible consequences and steps they can take to mitigate and reduce the risk. This is something that not enough Soldiers or units take seriously.

As to the original question of how to bring up the issue. The Performance Triad is (or should be) being taught through various Professional Military Education courses. I also saw it in a pre-command course for First Sergeants and Company Commanders some years back, though I don't know if it's formally part of the program of instruction. Master Fitness Trainers should certainly be in a position to advise the leadership team on the topic, my understanding is that they are trained on the resources available through Army Wellness Centers. However you bring up the topic of the Performance Triad politely and professionally through your chain of command, there are institutional resources to help educate them on its importance and their role(s).

Separately, if you find that sleep deprivation is impacting your health (it can and often does), identify that to your own primary care manager independently or through your period health assessment. It may be that the time you have really is sufficient, but you have something else going on that results in your sleep not being restful enough. A sleep study would identify if there is a larger concern that needs to be addressed for you.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Cpl Richard Baccarie
0
0
0
Do as your told. And please shut up. Come on man your in the United States Military. Are kidding me......
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CPO Gerald Rahm
0
0
0
Don't be such a pussy get over it. You sound like I ran out of bullets and its time to go home. Suck it up and move on.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SFC Operations Ncoic
0
0
0
you are whining! It sounds like that unit had soft leaders and the soldiers got use to it. I wonder what the physical fitness level of that unit is, probably not good.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
PFC Stephen Trynosky
0
0
0
You are a soldier. We are coming off the 75th Anniversary of the Battle of the Bulge which was an all hands operation including cooks, bakers, mechanics, and hospital medics. The enemy will not give you eight hours sleep. If you cannot handle that, leave after your current enlistment. there are a great many suburban police departments who will not only pay you a lot better but allow you to doze off on duty on a regular basis. Note: Stay away from Big City Police Departments.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CPO O'shay Morris
0
0
0
You suck it up buttercup and go PT. You guys have no idea how good you have it.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGT John Graham
0
0
0
Are you a Spec. 4 Mafia member? If not consult one. The members are virtuoso of the workaround; some even legal! That being said, work through the standard channels. Command will very likely accommodate a alternate schedule. Don't try to "skate", despite my introductory statement. Instead, try to be flexible and innovative with a solution.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Sgt Peter McDonald
0
0
0
What if you're in combat...are you going to tell the enemy to come back when you are better rested.
4 to 5 hours sleep is ample rest for you to PT. Once you're done, you can shower and take a nap.
It sucks that your schedule is not accommodating, but PT is not every day. We who have served have been through this....it is the nature of the beast.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGT Jody Beach
0
0
0
I do believe that Army is only required to give you 4 hours of sleep a night.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSgt Tim Self
0
0
0
A 6 hour shift. Like going in at 0730, getting off at 1330. Would you go to bed then or wait till 2200? Time management is key. Adjusting your short schedule to match the 1sg requirements is the solution.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SFC David Fullmer
0
0
0
Max your APFT and take advantage of any command policy allowing high scores to PT on their own.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small

Join nearly 2 million former and current members of the US military, just like you.

How are you connected to the military?
  • Active Duty
  • Active Reserve / National Guard
  • Pre-Commission
  • Veteran / Retired
  • Civilian Supporter