Posted on Jun 12, 2019
I am being told to go to PT by the command on only 4-5 hours of sleep. As a junior enlisted, how do I solve this problem?
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We have a new 1SG and new commander. The 1SG noticed one day that only 5 people in the whole company showed up to PT. Now he put out to all the platoon Sergeants that everyone must show up to PT at either the 0530 formation or the 1600 formation.
However, my section is the only one in the hospital that has a 1600-0000 shift. I am being told by my first line that the 1SG says that I have to be at the morning formation, no exceptions.
I don’t want to sound like I’m whining but at the same time it’s unfortunate that I have to explain to myself as to why this isn’t right.
As a junior enlisted I do feel stuck.
How do I bring this issue up and solve this effectively and professionally?
Also: Do you know of any Army Regulations that can support anything?
However, my section is the only one in the hospital that has a 1600-0000 shift. I am being told by my first line that the 1SG says that I have to be at the morning formation, no exceptions.
I don’t want to sound like I’m whining but at the same time it’s unfortunate that I have to explain to myself as to why this isn’t right.
As a junior enlisted I do feel stuck.
How do I bring this issue up and solve this effectively and professionally?
Also: Do you know of any Army Regulations that can support anything?
Company Commander
Physical Training
Army Regulations
Policy
Edited 6 y ago
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 1688
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Wow. Where are you stationed? Disneyland? We took naps in the Marines and found a wall to climb. What has happened to service to our country. Bo
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Wowie Batman! You're in the military now. Regulations state that soldiers can operate on 4 hours of non-consecutive sleep at minimum. They just have to allot time for you to rest. So in short, learn to manage your time properly so that you get proper rest the rest is out of your hands.
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Best bet is to see your NCOIC or Platoon Commander.
This sounds like the Co Cdr 1st Sgt have a time management and leadership issue.
This sounds like the Co Cdr 1st Sgt have a time management and leadership issue.
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LtCol Dennis Ivan
MSG Don Jones Nope, if the company commander and 1stSgt are too stupid or incompetent to be taxing their people disproportionately for their own convenience thats on them. Its called being a good leader. And given this is a Spc. maybe a couple of years vs a 1stSgt with 15 or more and a Capt with 5 or more plus OCS etc I can guarantee who the failure is.
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MSG Don Jones
The SP/4 needs to follow the order then explain the problem to the CoC it will work it's self out. The CoC is exercising control of a unit that seems to need some. After control is gained the exceptions will be made. It works better than onesies and twosies. It always does and always will. It's called being and exceptionally good leader
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LtCol Dennis Ivan
MSG Don Jones no MSG, its whats called pathetic leaders and SNCOs that should have exited long ago. "Exceptional leaders" already understand their unit, how it functions, and the schedules of all their people. "Exceptional leaders" dont need a SPC to tell them they are f'd up. Just washed up SNCOs and COs that are too lazy and too arrogant to get out of their office except for that one time they interact with their unit for the entire day.
There is a reason you are a MSG and not a 1stSgt.
There is a reason you are a MSG and not a 1stSgt.
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If you can not handle this on 4 hours sleep What the hell will you do under combat conditions. For God sakes Your not in the GIRL SCOUTS
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I agree with SFC Michael D., you are being prepared for battle at any given moment, you got this soldier!
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OH for pete's sake!!! Get deployed!! You will work for days on end with little sleep and your physical activity will go far beyond anything you do in PT!!!
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Get off shift, nap for about two or three hours, get up, go to PT, get that $#!+ done, bed back down for at least four more hours. This is my suggestion to YOU only. Deal with this as best as you can while you have the opportunity to sleep because when you deploy, your hours will be insane! If it is something you cannot adapt to and overcome after giving it a FAIR and HONEST effort, this job may not be for you.
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Wawawa....no solution necessary. Live with it...or get out. Thank you for your service.
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I don’t know what is your situation but when I was in, that was not an issue. However I was an 11B and sleep deprivation was part of the training
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The last I heard the Army was not a democracy. I’ve been out for some time now, 23 years to be exact. I hope it hasn’t changed. When I was in, it was a must that every soldier remained fit and disciplined. Is this not expected of each soldier today?
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LCDR (Join to see)
Chief, that's right up there with "this will look good on your eval." Those are words I learned not to believe as an MM2.
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Sorry but you need to suck it up. Yes you are whining. 5 hours is a good day for me. Getting exercise is great for you while you are junior enlisted. Get in the exercise while you can still do it pain free.
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You damn whoose, you stayed out late and now you pay the piper. No where does it say you can stay out late and be given the right to get your beauty rest.
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You are working a swing shit, that mean you need to adjust your sleep patterns. After PT, shower and go to bed. It’s so easy a cave man can do it. Millions of people work swing shifts, welcome to the workforce
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I concur with the time management. Who knows, maybe that PT in the morning will let you sleep better. How about the rest of the 1600-2400 personnel. What do they do? Do they whine about the PT also? And this is about the PT and not the time frame.
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WTF!....
I remember going to the club on Wednesdays and getting back to the barracks at 0100 hrs. and be at PT formation at 0600 hrs. without a problem...LoL
I remember going to the club on Wednesdays and getting back to the barracks at 0100 hrs. and be at PT formation at 0600 hrs. without a problem...LoL
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Do you really believe that war is on a schedule? The enemy will not allow you 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep. The initial 2003 push into Iraq was essentially 3 to 5 days of uninterrupted engagement with the enemy for conventional forces. I am still up at 0520 every day to voluntarily do what your 1SGT makes you do. Stop whining and get with the program.
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LCDR (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see) - Considering I've made it farther in the armed forces that you have, I'm going to guess that I'm probably a better judge of that than you are. But thank you for your opinion. I'm sure you think it's worth something.
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CPT (Join to see)
LCDR (Join to see) - Sir, You certainly have reached a higher rank than I have. Then again you probably weren't wounded as I was.
The Navy and the Army are very different organizations and attract different types of individuals. The Navy like the Air Force (not an insult) attract very intelligent and technical types (except for NSW ;). While the Army has its share of intelligent individuals we are the ones that need to march 20 miles plus in the rain or over the mountains conduct an ambush and then figure a way to get back out. We always have plans for the latter but more often than not the friction of war seems to catch up once you have made contact with the enemy.
I hope that you will forgive me for the snarky remark, you deserved better (I am not being insincere).
The Navy and the Army are very different organizations and attract different types of individuals. The Navy like the Air Force (not an insult) attract very intelligent and technical types (except for NSW ;). While the Army has its share of intelligent individuals we are the ones that need to march 20 miles plus in the rain or over the mountains conduct an ambush and then figure a way to get back out. We always have plans for the latter but more often than not the friction of war seems to catch up once you have made contact with the enemy.
I hope that you will forgive me for the snarky remark, you deserved better (I am not being insincere).
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LCDR (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see) - No worries. We've all been there.
While I haven't been wounded in combat, do come at the situation with a mustang's perspective. I hit boot camp in July of 1994 and made it to E-6 before I sold my soul and went to the dark side. During that time, I've worked in steam plants and fought fires. I respect the need for "just do what I told you" as much as any other military leader (except for the Space Force).
That said, though, there's also a time and place for a Soldier to speak up for herself. The circumstance she was given were absurd. Doesn't mean she can't do them. But I question a leader who would tolerate that condition for a long period of time. As I said elsewhere, if I made a habit of bringing my guys in five hours after shift, every workday.. the CO would have me thrown out of his squadron without hesitation. That's what's happening with her - she's being told to do something that it would never occur to a leader to tell the bulk of the troops to do - again, not on occasion, but as her normal work schedule for months or years.
The correct answer, of course, is for her to do what she's told... but also speak to her chain of command. If her chain of command doesn't want the inconvenience of PTing her (and others like her) an hour before her shift, then they're making her shoulder the burden of their own laziness.
I also understand that when you're operational, you don't always get the sleep you want. I had the privilege of being the Detachment Maintenance Office (DETMO) for the helo squadron embarked aboard the USNS Comfort during hurricane Maria recovery in Puerto Rico. Neither my maintainers nor I got much sleep (and what sleep I did get, I cut into to hit the gym), but we knew that was part of the game. That said, though, it would have been absurd to ask them to hit 16-hour days back at homeguard without good reason (such as getting a detachment out the door).
That's the point I'm getting to. As leaders, we need to take care of our troops. Beat them when you need to - we're in the military after all. But when you can, you need to give them a break. Or as a chief once told me, there are enough bad deals in the Navy to go around - we don't need to go making our own.
While I haven't been wounded in combat, do come at the situation with a mustang's perspective. I hit boot camp in July of 1994 and made it to E-6 before I sold my soul and went to the dark side. During that time, I've worked in steam plants and fought fires. I respect the need for "just do what I told you" as much as any other military leader (except for the Space Force).
That said, though, there's also a time and place for a Soldier to speak up for herself. The circumstance she was given were absurd. Doesn't mean she can't do them. But I question a leader who would tolerate that condition for a long period of time. As I said elsewhere, if I made a habit of bringing my guys in five hours after shift, every workday.. the CO would have me thrown out of his squadron without hesitation. That's what's happening with her - she's being told to do something that it would never occur to a leader to tell the bulk of the troops to do - again, not on occasion, but as her normal work schedule for months or years.
The correct answer, of course, is for her to do what she's told... but also speak to her chain of command. If her chain of command doesn't want the inconvenience of PTing her (and others like her) an hour before her shift, then they're making her shoulder the burden of their own laziness.
I also understand that when you're operational, you don't always get the sleep you want. I had the privilege of being the Detachment Maintenance Office (DETMO) for the helo squadron embarked aboard the USNS Comfort during hurricane Maria recovery in Puerto Rico. Neither my maintainers nor I got much sleep (and what sleep I did get, I cut into to hit the gym), but we knew that was part of the game. That said, though, it would have been absurd to ask them to hit 16-hour days back at homeguard without good reason (such as getting a detachment out the door).
That's the point I'm getting to. As leaders, we need to take care of our troops. Beat them when you need to - we're in the military after all. But when you can, you need to give them a break. Or as a chief once told me, there are enough bad deals in the Navy to go around - we don't need to go making our own.
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So you get up at 0445 head to PT grab some chow afterwards and take a nap. Welcome to the Military Buttercup.
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