Posted on Feb 4, 2015
Is it appropiate for a prior service member to correct service members on AR 670-1 violations?
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Is it appropriate for any PSMs to correct the violations of AR 670-1 on any currently serving SM? This includes any rank (PVT to O-5). As a PSM who honorably served in the Army, I see many soldiers who violate AR 670-1, And I have corrected most, including SGTs and higher (I am a PV2). Am I wrong for this? And, can we, as PSMs report disrespect after corrections to brigade commanders if corrections are ignored? Thoughts, please.
Posted 11 y ago
Responses: 77
Discretion is the better part of valor ..... Your question poses - is it appropriate? You then further clarify to include only PVT to LTC.
If we're talking about a flagrant violation, tact and common sense rules the day. There is a way to point out an issue without making it personal or destructive and that may be your best course of action. What matters is how the issue is presented and that it is truly outside the AR 670-1 regs. Being nit-picky just because you can is no reason to call someone out.
I tend to think how you approach it is 75% of the problem. All members want to be inside the regs but no one enjoys being berated over something that, in the grand scheme of things, is small potatoes.
If we're talking about a flagrant violation, tact and common sense rules the day. There is a way to point out an issue without making it personal or destructive and that may be your best course of action. What matters is how the issue is presented and that it is truly outside the AR 670-1 regs. Being nit-picky just because you can is no reason to call someone out.
I tend to think how you approach it is 75% of the problem. All members want to be inside the regs but no one enjoys being berated over something that, in the grand scheme of things, is small potatoes.
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I am not in-depth with the latest 670-1 or any of the regulations but if I see a soldier that is obviously ate up I will politely stop them and make the correction. I may be a veteran but the NCO in me is still there but I do things on a much more even keel now. Truth be told most soldiers will be like thanks.
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If a currenty SM is wrong and a Past SM knows the regulation then by all means correct and inject knowledge into the current SM so he/she will know. Ignorance is only bliss until you are no longer ignorant of the situation.
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Not in the game. So I would not make uniform corrections. If a soldier can't respect themselves not my problem.
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PV2 Daniel Shipley
But, because you served, don't you still have respect for the same uniform you once wore to defend your country? SGT Francis Wright Thank you for your feedback.
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SGT Francis Wright
Of course I respect the uniform I have been a veteran for 19 years. Soldiers today don't even wear the same uniform I did. Not really my place, I just shake my head fore I have seen higher ranks pass a soup sandwich and say nothing.
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Square them away!!!!! We've all been there. Active or Veteran. Don't be the Blue Falcon!!!!
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No, I don't think it is appropriate, and I have never seen it happen. Serving members have a chain of command, and on-the-spot corrections in a public setting are always inappropriate, especially coming from someone that is no longer on a contract. What you could do is ask politely for that individual's company/ shop/ platoon, and speak with their leadership offline and let them handle it. I know a lot of 'lifers' and gung-ho vets out there don't like that answer, but the harsh reality is that you had your time to shine, and you served your nation well; it's time to let the next generation on NCOs handle their men and women, and how those serving today look in public is a direct reflection of their leadership- hold them accountable.
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I even fix civilians if I see the caller up I approach them and tell them I'm going to touch you and fix there caller something about this drives me nuts. Lol. And then I live near an air force base where they issue access cards to get to certain private places on the base I see them in the local Walmart with them displaying it on the outside as a former security forces officer I fight the response to yank it off and turn it into the base commander as not having it displayed is a big part of opsec. My one question is has the regulations changed to where it's ok to wear your uniform off base to shop? And how safe is this practice?
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PV2 Daniel Shipley
As far as I know, there where no changes to the AR-670-1 regarding wearing uniform off base, on none duty. I believe it shouldn't be done unless traveling to or from your duty station.
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SGT (Join to see)
CONUS is fine, depending on certain situations, base commander may issue a memo to change before leaving post. As far as OCONUS, I can only speak for Germany. you cannot wear your uniform off base in public. You can wear it in you car going from base to base but if you live off base, you must change.
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It is not only appropriate, it is our duty 24/7. The Army works when the Army polices itself. Professional prompt uniform corrections are always in order. I would always want to know if I was not right, as it was likely by an accidental error vs. an intentional act.
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Capt (Join to see)
Since I haven't worn the uniform since 1986, and I was never knowledgeable of AR 670-1 I would not attempt correct a now serving member.
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MSgt Garrick Hill
Absolutely appropriate to correct! A uniform violation is a uniform violation regardless of accidental or intentional or who corrects it.
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Depends... I mean I wouldn't necessarily correct them. Regulations change, I would privately talk to them... Here is why I am on the fence about it...
I was home on leave and I saw a guy out bowling with his buddies wearing his black zip up and is name and rank on it ( I think that is what he was wearing it was a couple years ago)...Now I am from a small town so military plays a huge part there and I know that he was excited to be in the military and blah blah blah...
My husband was prior service in the Army and pointed it out, My husband doesn't want confrontation so he let it go. I was like I am not, he is using it to try and get things for free. He is the reason a lot of people hate giving discounts to people who deserve it. I wanted to make sure I knew what I was talking about before I confronted him. At the time of this incident my team lead was actually an Army SSG, so I called him. I asked if what the Soldier was wearing was out of regs. SSG confirmed that we were right. I didn't want to blast him in front of his buddies so I called him over to us. There were like 8 people in the entire building. ( My Dad who was running the place, my son (2yr old at the time) my husband, and then his group.
I have really good hearing so I heard him telling his buddies see I told you it pays off (thinking I was going to pay for bowling or drinks....this eerked me a little but I kept my composure and I went along for the ride. He was a SPC (I think) I asked him how long he was in the service, where he was stationed. (I can't remember the answers) but what I do remember is what happened next...
I asked him how well he knew uniform regulations...he went from looking relaxed to a "bucking up" stance. He was like yes why...I was like look don't be so defensive, I know you know you are wrong and that is all I am going to say. He questioned how I knew and I showed him my ID. He continued to state that he was going to do what he wanted and I couldn't stop him. I out ranked him and told him to give me his Company's information and he did (At this point the NCO in me started coming out, I hate being disrespected). I called my SSG and gave him the low down. Within 10 minutes, I see the Soldier get a phone call and you could see the embarrassment just crossing his face as he was taking his stuff off his jacket. A small part of me felt really bad for him, but then again he could have just taking my advice and he wouldn't have been embarrassed in front of his buddies. His buddy came up and was like was that necessary and I told him no it wasn't I gave him a chance to take it off and that was it but he wanted to disrespect me as a higher ranking military member. His buddy apologized and went back.
I would never intentionally want to embarrass someone, but don't be a jerk to me either. I get the fact that he wanted to show off his military service, but do it correctly. You never know who is around you and your in the military your under strict orders that you are supposed to follow.
I was home on leave and I saw a guy out bowling with his buddies wearing his black zip up and is name and rank on it ( I think that is what he was wearing it was a couple years ago)...Now I am from a small town so military plays a huge part there and I know that he was excited to be in the military and blah blah blah...
My husband was prior service in the Army and pointed it out, My husband doesn't want confrontation so he let it go. I was like I am not, he is using it to try and get things for free. He is the reason a lot of people hate giving discounts to people who deserve it. I wanted to make sure I knew what I was talking about before I confronted him. At the time of this incident my team lead was actually an Army SSG, so I called him. I asked if what the Soldier was wearing was out of regs. SSG confirmed that we were right. I didn't want to blast him in front of his buddies so I called him over to us. There were like 8 people in the entire building. ( My Dad who was running the place, my son (2yr old at the time) my husband, and then his group.
I have really good hearing so I heard him telling his buddies see I told you it pays off (thinking I was going to pay for bowling or drinks....this eerked me a little but I kept my composure and I went along for the ride. He was a SPC (I think) I asked him how long he was in the service, where he was stationed. (I can't remember the answers) but what I do remember is what happened next...
I asked him how well he knew uniform regulations...he went from looking relaxed to a "bucking up" stance. He was like yes why...I was like look don't be so defensive, I know you know you are wrong and that is all I am going to say. He questioned how I knew and I showed him my ID. He continued to state that he was going to do what he wanted and I couldn't stop him. I out ranked him and told him to give me his Company's information and he did (At this point the NCO in me started coming out, I hate being disrespected). I called my SSG and gave him the low down. Within 10 minutes, I see the Soldier get a phone call and you could see the embarrassment just crossing his face as he was taking his stuff off his jacket. A small part of me felt really bad for him, but then again he could have just taking my advice and he wouldn't have been embarrassed in front of his buddies. His buddy came up and was like was that necessary and I told him no it wasn't I gave him a chance to take it off and that was it but he wanted to disrespect me as a higher ranking military member. His buddy apologized and went back.
I would never intentionally want to embarrass someone, but don't be a jerk to me either. I get the fact that he wanted to show off his military service, but do it correctly. You never know who is around you and your in the military your under strict orders that you are supposed to follow.
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