Posted on Jun 21, 2014
SSgt Structural Craftsman
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CMDCM Gene Treants
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SA Harrold Hansman pointed out to me that many people view Football as a Religion. I know that I have heard the Name of God invoked often and pitifully by both sides at many "games." Since so many pray at Football Games and view it as such, should it be covered under the First Amendment and be protected?

In Fact, does the Freedom of Speech Clause of the 1st also apply? If so, should the Federal Government just bow out of the entire debate?
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SGT Thomas Sullivan
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Ive been a redskins fan since I was a kid. If we had to change our name, our games against Dallas would never be the same.
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SFC Quality Control Technical Inspector
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Maybe the Native Americans are really only upset because the Redskins keep loosing...Go Cowboys!
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CMDCM Gene Treants
CMDCM Gene Treants
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Dl1 %282%29
Sorry SSG Gilbreath, I only root for two teams Greenbay Packers and whoever is Playing Dallas! I wanted to give you a down vote, but could only consider your team loyalty as a character flaw.
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SA David Kilduff
SA David Kilduff
>1 y
The wrong question is being asked here. It is not whether the football team that has had there name for more then 70 years trademarked  and patented the name and logo that the Federal Government can force it's will on private business whether revoking trademarks or by EPA mandates how much are the American People willing to give up in their Freedoms?
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SFC Quality Control Technical Inspector
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MCPO Gene Treants, I like the Packers a little too but dont tell anybody, I dont want people to think I am a closset Yankee.
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SFC Quality Control Technical Inspector
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SA David Kilduff, Amen Brother!
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
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Edited >1 y ago
If it is Morally and Socially Offensive. No. If I am not mistaken they had their Trademark Removed by the League 17 years ago but a Court Reinstated it. It is going to happen anyway might as well do it today an move on. I've lost track of the times teams have been moved and or had their name changed. I can't understand hanging onto a name that offends people for what? Tradition? Slavery was a Tradition Once. Thank God we moved past that.
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CMDCM Gene Treants
CMDCM Gene Treants
>1 y
Bring back the Milwaukee Braves!!! Oh, wait, they were the Boston Braves before that, Darn. Guess I lost that argument.
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SPC Christopher Smith
SPC Christopher Smith
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Slavery was not a tradtion, slavery was a business practice. Comparing slavery to the Redskins name is not even close.
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
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Dude! Thanks for the History Education SPC Sean Cross but Damn. I wasn't aware of that. That is pretty gross. Amazing how awful humans can be to one another.
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SFC Quality Control Technical Inspector
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I am just one person, but like many in our country I am of mixed race. I feel that is one thing that has made our country so strong, the merging of different tallents and backgrounds that influence the way that we think. I am a mix of Scottish, Irish, Jew and American Indian among other things. I am not offended at all by the Redskins name or the Cheifs or Braves or any other sports teams. When the name was sellected some 80 years ago it was to show respect to the local tribes and honor their warrior spirit. But I guess it is not politically correct to be a warrior these days.

Just because a small group makes a lot of noise about a topic does not mean it is wrong. Look at the vile way that some Americans treated our very own Soldiers when they returned from Veitnam, it wasnt the majority of the nation doing it but that "minority" group spoke louder than the rightious ones. I am not saying their feelings are invalid but it should not force a change of something they are not involved in anyway. It reminds me of an athiest friend who gets offended at the fact that I pray to a God that he does not believe in, even though he has never witnessed me doing it and I have never tried to pressure him to my beliefs, he is offended that I believe differently than him. He is entitled to his oppinions as am I. Should I have to stop believing because he is so easily offended about something he does not believe in anyway (my invisable friend)?

Ok I am rambling so I will stop.
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SFC Quality Control Technical Inspector
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Here is a quick (but incomplete) article on the origins of the Redskins name.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/11/do-you-know-the-history-behind-the-name-washington-redskins/
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CMDCM Gene Treants
CMDCM Gene Treants
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Thanks SSG Gilbreath. A very informative post that should really be read by all. If it was read and UNDERSTOOD this might actually put an end to the discussion, but ...
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Cpl Brett Wagner
Cpl Brett Wagner
>1 y
SGT Newman - You beat me to it! Yeah it was a great story and I think there is still some mystery behind Mr. Dietz a clearly German name however that doe snot mean you do not have American Indian blood. The most successful and well known American Indian artist of the 20th century was/is Fritz Scholder was obviously at least half German.
I am not sure how many of American Indian background will agree with me, but I prefer the term name American Indian because anyone who is born in America is a Native American, however NOT anyone born in America can claim American Indian heritage. Again just my view, if someone wants to be called a shopping cart so be it.


http://nmai.si.edu/explore/exhibitions/item/38/
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SA Harold Hansmann
SA Harold Hansmann
>1 y
Very informative news article with Video clip. Thank you ssg. Now all the whiners can (oh what I really wanna say) pipe down and pull up their big boy/girl pants.
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SFC Rich Carey
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This is though one. Anything and everything can be offensive to someone somewhere. (Broadly speaking) Why is it the few, force the many to change? Why is red neck still accepted? "It is time to crack the whip", a person took offense because he said being derogatory and racist. I am sure we can go on and on.....
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LTC Deputy Division Chief
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If you change this team name. We will have to change the rest of the teams names. Then PETA will get involved and no teams will have animal names. Where does this stop? If this was shown in a denigrating and derogatory manner then yes. But this name for this team has been around longer than the people that are "offended". Lastly my issue or biggest complaint is it has gotten into politics. Politicians pandering votes and worrying about a business instead of other pressing issues.
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SPC Charles Brown
SPC Charles Brown
>1 y
Thanks for the up vote Major, no worries, I've got your back.
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SPC Charles Brown
SPC Charles Brown
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I am part Native American (Indian) and I see nothing offensive in any team that has a reference to the American Indian. Some people just need to lighten up.
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LTC Deputy Division Chief
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The sad thing is that it's just a small percentage that are having issues. And it's not just this topic. Many topics.
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SPC Charles Brown
SPC Charles Brown
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Ok, in the immortal words of Drill Sergeant Hulka; everyone say it with me now, "Lighten up Francis". And to think I hate the movie Stripes.
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SA Harold Hansmann
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Screw that political correctness crap.
It doesn't seem to have bothered the Indians in all this time. Leave it the heck alone. I don't even like football. Just so sick of these political correct shenanigans.
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SA Harold Hansmann
SA Harold Hansmann
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Master chief, to some people football is a religion. So maybe it qualifies under that aspect.
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MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca
MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca
>1 y
Was that the Brady Bill CMDCM Gene Treants ? Nope, I'm confusing Jim with Tom :-)
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CMDCM Gene Treants
CMDCM Gene Treants
>1 y
SA Harold Hansmann i think you are correct. Therefore Football is covered under the First Amendment and is protect both as a Religion and under Freedom of Speech! GR8 Catch Sir!
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COL James Stevens Roach
COL James Stevens Roach
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Amanda Blackhorse, a Navajo who successfully moved a federal agency to withdraw trademark protections from the Washington Redskins because it considers the team's name derogatory, lives on a reservation where Navajos root for the Red Mesa High School Redskins. She opposes this name; the Native Americans who picked and retain it evidently do not.
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SPC Phillip Ludlow
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2013 09 11 washingtonredskinslogo
Come on! its the redskins! if they change their name a little piece of american pride dies with it!
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MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca
MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca
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SFC Cook, You have stated in more than one post that Native American were murdered, mistreated and disrespected by the US military and the US government. You wear the uniform of the very people you say did all these things to your ancestors. IMHO, I believe you do so out of respect for the country and I'm making the assumption that you descend from a distinguished line of warriors and are taking your rightful place in that lineage. I ask this with all due respect to your point of view, how you manage and maintain balance between, what I perceive is a conflict with your military service and your deep feelings for your culture and ancestory?
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SPC Phillip Ludlow
SPC Phillip Ludlow
>1 y
My grandmother was a creek, and the community i grew up in had deep roots in native american culture as well as some Irish and a good bit of southern hospitality. we all love the Atalanta braves, and thats just the way it is. in any view, i dont mind if people express their opinions, hell its an American right. i also think highly of people who stand by their their beliefs whether its united or own thier own.however i feel this conversation has gotten a bit outside my comfort zone, and ill leave it at that.
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CW3 Maintenance Technician
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I think its easy for people who isn't being referred to as "redskin" to say its not offensive and don't change it. BLUF, if Native Americans are offended then it needs to be changed. That isn't being overly "PC" that's just common decency.
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CW3 Maintenance Technician
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Sir,
The term is debatable from what you stated it means or a reference to skin color.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redskin_(slang)
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SSgt Structural Craftsman
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Yup wikipedia is a very reputable source
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SSG Daniel Deiler
SSG Daniel Deiler
>1 y
If someone calls me a Cracker, a Redneck, Gringo, Honky, Haole, Round Eye, Peckerwood, etc etc I am not offended by it. I choose not to take offense. I refuse to give those words any power. If you choose to give those words or any derrogatory words power, that's on you. Not only does it make the person using those words against you look stupid and uneducated, but it makes you look weak in their eyes. Don't give someone else that power over your emotions and your mind.


Secondly, the word, as used by the team, Redskins is NOT derogatory in any shape form or fashion. It describes the mascot and the team, not an individual. Shall I back that up with PROOF positive that American Indians by and large do not find it offensive? How about the Red Mesa High Redskins? It is a public high school on a Navajo Reservation in Arizona that is attended by nearly 100% Navajo children (as per the schools website). Yep...truly an offensive name. Sooooo offensive that the Navajo tribe uses it as a high school mascot.
http://rmusdhs.ss4.sharpschool.com/
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