Posted on Jan 14, 2015
On the spot corrections in public; when is it appropriate?
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This weekend me and my GF decided to get out and go to the movies not near any military base once so ever (maybe a Reserve or NG training facility could be near by). So I'm glancing around notice a uniform on a young lady and her hair down with a PT cap on inside of the mall. I didn't loose my mind at first because it could be anyone just wearing the uniform these days. As I get closer to her I notice she has on SPC rank. I told my GF that I have to say something to her and of course she didn't understand. When I approached the SPC and her civilian male acquaintance, I asked her was she in the Army and she quickly replied "yes". So I asked her did she know she was in complete violation of Army Regs she says "yes". The female rolled her eyes at me and I could tell she was going to have
a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation. So at what point do we as leaders make a on the spot correction in public or remove ourselves from the situation? I felt at the time as a NCO I should have done more to make her fix herself, but on the other hand I didn't want to make a scene at the mall and in public. SPC Ware I definitely will remember you forever.
a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation. So at what point do we as leaders make a on the spot correction in public or remove ourselves from the situation? I felt at the time as a NCO I should have done more to make her fix herself, but on the other hand I didn't want to make a scene at the mall and in public. SPC Ware I definitely will remember you forever.
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 709
Guess I'm a little lost, why would she even wear it to go to the movies. Are you allowed to wear ACU off post to go to the movies? I'm afraid an attitude would not have gone very well with me. I agree with the others correct in private but the correction needs to be made.
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SSG (Join to see)
I was wondering that same thing too. Why was she out to movies in uniform? In today's climate of terrorism activities she just made herself a soft target.
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Lt Col (Join to see)
Well, do we know for sure she was going to the movies? On more than one occasion, I've swung by the theater during lunch or on my way home, in uniform, to purchase tickets for an upcoming event. I have NEVER worn my uniform to a stateside movie theater though (just the one at Al Udeid).
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SGT Roberto Mendoza-Diaz
There are no regulations against it, however with the continually threat from ISIS and other terrorist groups, it is recommended not to wear your uniform in public.
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MSgt (Join to see)
SGT Roberto Mendoza-Diaz
Thank you for the clarification. I knew the Marine Corps would not allow it wasn't sure about the Army. But I would agree not a good practice.
Thank you for the clarification. I knew the Marine Corps would not allow it wasn't sure about the Army. But I would agree not a good practice.
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So let me get this straight. You, as a Staff Sergeant, backed down from a SPC while making a correction just because she was throwing attitude your way? You should probably sit down and rethink exactly what your profession, as an NCO, really means to you. And we, as a collective service, wonder why the ranks are running around without any sense of self discipline and or fear of being corrected.
On that note, I would have jumped not only jumped all over that SPC with the attitude, I would have kindly escorted her out of the movie theater. Then the next day, I would have made a visit to her unit and had a talk with not only her company commander but her Sergeant Major.
On that note, I would have jumped not only jumped all over that SPC with the attitude, I would have kindly escorted her out of the movie theater. Then the next day, I would have made a visit to her unit and had a talk with not only her company commander but her Sergeant Major.
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I also found myself in the same situation as a junior NCO. I was on vacation in Florida and noticed an NCO that was walking around an outlet mall (where all store fronts are outside) without head gear. I approached the soldier who was straight out of basic training and introduced myself and showed my ID card so they didn't think I was just some guy. When doing this i separated myself from my family and requested the individual to remove himself from his group. I continued to inform the soldier they were representing the military at all times and should take pride when wearing the uniform and always wear it properly. I didn't do this in a demeaning manor, as I wanted to let them know they were wrong and there would always be someone nearby that knew what right looked like. I also reminded him of his army values and sent him on his way. The soldier thanked me and carried on with his activities in the correct uniform.
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SSG (Join to see)
When I initially went to her I was expecting to correct her and for her to correct the deficiency. Some situations are different than others. Glad you were able to fix it.
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I have made corrections in Wal-Mart....full uniform, with cover on. I just quietly approached the individual and reminded him that the cover was not approved to be worn indoors. I was in civilian clothes, but I think he suddenly realized that I may be someone that could do something about it and quickly removed his cover. I moved on without making it a big deal.
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I made an on the spot correction when I saw a service member in a truck stop without his uniform top. I waited til we were in an area where it was semi private, I pulled out my ID and identified myself and told him he was out of uniform and that he should correct himself. He asked for my 1SG's contact info which I gave him. He never identified himself.
I found out later that he was a 1LT from a reserve unit in the area. He told my company commander that I was yelling at him in front of a bunch of civilians and had embarrased him. That's the point he f!@#d up big time. My commander got his information and informed him that if I had made an on the spot correction then he should have fixed himself. My commander then went on to say that in the 18 or so months that he had known me he had never one time heard me raise my voice to anyone, inculding my Soldiers.
The officer that I corrected had HIS commander called about the entire deal.
So, yes, you should have made a correction on the spot, if she had copped an attituded then she deserved to get embarrassed for her actions. If she would have gotten loud, you stand your ground and let her make an ass of herself. All you needed was her name, rank and unit to make phone inquirees of local units.
There is always something you can do, and should do. Remember, you are an NCO 24/7 365, and if you can't make decisions then you need to rethink your career choice.
I found out later that he was a 1LT from a reserve unit in the area. He told my company commander that I was yelling at him in front of a bunch of civilians and had embarrased him. That's the point he f!@#d up big time. My commander got his information and informed him that if I had made an on the spot correction then he should have fixed himself. My commander then went on to say that in the 18 or so months that he had known me he had never one time heard me raise my voice to anyone, inculding my Soldiers.
The officer that I corrected had HIS commander called about the entire deal.
So, yes, you should have made a correction on the spot, if she had copped an attituded then she deserved to get embarrassed for her actions. If she would have gotten loud, you stand your ground and let her make an ass of herself. All you needed was her name, rank and unit to make phone inquirees of local units.
There is always something you can do, and should do. Remember, you are an NCO 24/7 365, and if you can't make decisions then you need to rethink your career choice.
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SSG (Join to see) Great post, It takes character and intestine fortitude to make the hard right over the easy wrong call, by having pride for the uniform and enforcing the regulation instead of letting it go. Shows a lot of leadership by doing what's right in the absence of orders. I say hoooha.
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MAJ (Join to see)
SFC Davis,
He didn't enforce any regulation. All he did was "asked her was she in the Army and she quickly replied "yes". So I asked her did she know she was in complete violation of Army Regs she says "yes". The female rolled her eyes at me and I could tell she was going to have a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation."
No offense intended but I fail to see any sort of regulation being enforced.
He didn't enforce any regulation. All he did was "asked her was she in the Army and she quickly replied "yes". So I asked her did she know she was in complete violation of Army Regs she says "yes". The female rolled her eyes at me and I could tell she was going to have a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation."
No offense intended but I fail to see any sort of regulation being enforced.
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What the H311 am I looking at? Willful disobedience to boot! There are those who are simply begging to be disciplined. AND then there are those that convince me that we need a lifeguard at the gene pool.
SSG (Join to see) you might have made the right decision to not make a scene, however, I definitely would have been more engaged and asked for her ID card and unit information. It is Soldiers who behave in that manner who bring dishonor to our service.
SSG (Join to see) you might have made the right decision to not make a scene, however, I definitely would have been more engaged and asked for her ID card and unit information. It is Soldiers who behave in that manner who bring dishonor to our service.
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I simply approach and Say, "You are always being watched. So you need to do the right thing." Then calmly walk away. Paranoia is so effective.
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SSG (Join to see)
The problem I have with all the confrontational responses is that it allows the possibility of becoming a fight, a challenge, a loud argument. The soldier takes a position that he is off base and thus you are out of your lane.
It doesn't matter that you are right and the soldier is wrong. It is not a matter of who is right so much as what is right. The right thing is to maintain uniform standards for the pride of both the service and the service members.
If the troop wants to be an asshat then be assured they will act the fool in front of their own chain of command where repercussions are more simple and direct.
It doesn't matter that you are right and the soldier is wrong. It is not a matter of who is right so much as what is right. The right thing is to maintain uniform standards for the pride of both the service and the service members.
If the troop wants to be an asshat then be assured they will act the fool in front of their own chain of command where repercussions are more simple and direct.
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Wow, hell yes! On the spot correction was totally appropriate. It really angers me that we have Servicemembers who think that is ok, let's not even mention the fact that she's at the movies in uniform...
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MGySgt Charles Anderson
As a Leader, your have just ruined that Soldier's career by NOT ensuring that she corrects her appearance. Now she will do it all the time and use your name. It all starts in Recruit Training. If she would have caused a scene as a soldier then, you as a Leader should have shown her what the consequence would be.
MGySgt Charles Anderson, USMC, Retired!
MGySgt Charles Anderson, USMC, Retired!
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MSG Scott McBride
Agreed, I would not have berated her in public (even though she deserves to be embarrassed) but she would have complied with my transmission!
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CPT Gerald Ramseyer
I guess I'm just an old salty Marine. In my day, if an NCO or Officer came across an improperly uniformed member of the Armed Forces, correction would have been swift and complete. No questions, no privacy no shit!
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Enforce the standard, or you have set a new one. if it's too public and will go too high-profile and can't pull aside as SMSgt Minister Gerald A. Thomas suggested, memorize name, contact chain of command.
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