Posted on Jan 11, 2014
Should the U.S. Army have one grooming standard (i.e. hair) for male and females?
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Should we allow well groomed beards like most Professional Armies in the world.
Posted in these groups: 
Grooming Standards
Women in the Military
Grooming Standards Women in the Military
Posted 12 y ago
Responses: 59
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I thought we are SERVICE MEMBERS. Women want to have equal opportunity and I am all for that, but I believe that there should be one and only one standard across the board. Same grooming standards (cut it off), same Pt standards (why should a 17-21 yr old woman be able to do 42 push ups and max when a male in the same age group has to do 71?), and take out your ear rings (males cant wear them)!!!! ONE STANDARD should be implemented for all service members, but will that ever happen? not a chance
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SSG (Join to see)
I've always been of the opinion PT standards should be based on an individuals body type and age not their gender.
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MAJ (Join to see)
This could be taken as extreme but, even mother nature has 2
standards so, why can’t we? I’m just
saying…
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SSG (Join to see)
it is a tough topic, just my opinion. You are correct, mother nature has 2 standards and it looks like the US Army has followed suit. like I said, very tough topic and it will always strike a good debate.
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SGT(P) (Join to see)
SSG Cravens, I'm curious as to how body type would play into the PT standard? I fully agree women who want to pursue the Combat side should have to pass the current male standards.
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If we look at the original reasons for the standard of short hair and no facial hair (beards), then the answer should be yes, all service members should adhere to the standards for male grooming. The prevention of lice and associated diseases while living in austere environments at close quarters was once a concern. Additionally, the fitment of protective masks and other facial PPE and operational equipment is hindered by beard growth.
It is apparent that the lice concern is no longer a factor, otherwise there would be no female grooming standard. As for the beard interfering with equipment, I cant see that that has changed. Perhaps the threat of chemical weapons is diminished to a point where pro-masks are no longer considered vital? I will not speculate on that.
So, if we assume that the real, concrete reason for the standard no longer exists, then why do we still have it? One word: Tradition. I am not attacking or defending traditions, just aknowledging that they exist and they are the reason behind much of what we do.
As for changing standards to accomodate everyone to do every job, I feel that if the standard is legitimate, then it should stand, regardless of who is trying to meet it. If a Service Member (male or female) wishes to serve in a rigorous, combat related position, they should all be held to the same standards. The worst thing we can do is put someone on the ground in combat who is a liability to the Service member next to him/her.
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I understand the need for hair and beards to be kept neat and trimmed, be it Army or Navy. However some soldiers would take to the extreem. Now as of womans hair, ponytail, or bun. as long as it doesnt interfere in their jobs. Long hair for males, no, beards, as long as they are neat and trimmed and just so long. And as long as they are in the middle east, Conus, no dont think so.
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Interesting question as the distinction between what constitutes a male or a female continues to get blurred in the media and by some activists.
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MAJ (Join to see)
You hit it on the head MSG Dowler. it is also about perception and
interpretation of the standard.
interpretation of the standard.
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I do not think there should be a " One rule for grooming standard for male and females". I do however, believe that there should be length and not just to the eyebrows when styled. For women, there should be a definite length, not just well it can not hit the back of their collar standard. When some women wear their hair in a bun or have weaves of different hair color or what not it sticks out like a sore thumb and IMO when they wear their headgear it looks like it's about to fall off from the wind. Also, when wearing their ACH they have difficulty shooting since the damn ACH keeps being pushed down from the bundle of joy ( their bun) beating them back against their forehead. As for the males, I have seen some burly hair that just looks like a rat nest. Again, having a uniformed hair length would be my suggestion on that aspect. I think a good medium fade would suffice. I am not saying every swinging Richard needs a High and Tight. For some they just look ridiculous and just doesn't fit their head. Also, for both men and women shaving..... well ALL men should while on duty, unless on leave. And some women...... well, some i'm just jealous since they got a nicely trimmed beard going on lol. I think they should too. BUT, again this is all my opinion.... LET THE COMMENTS, COMMENCE. :)
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LTC Jason Bartlett
See SSG Woods you thought the question had no validity. They do exist in our Army as well.
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2LT (Join to see)
I have the craziest thickiest hair. If i cut it short it turns into an Afro.. a full.. on... AFRO. It's better I have it long and in a bigger bun that look completely unprofessional looking like I just got electrocuted.
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SSG Jason Neumann
1LT Papproth, examples are always welcome. If it WAS out of regulation and currently isn't then no harm, no foul.
2LT Shelton, thick hair is understanding, but taming it would be a better way. How to do that, I have no idea how to do that, since I am not a woman. I do know a way, but I am sure a crew cut just wouldn't fit with most women mind set. Although, I have seen some women have serious HIGH and Tights that look amazing and possibly too BUTCH. At any rate, medium fades all around. Carry on, LGOPS.
2LT Shelton, thick hair is understanding, but taming it would be a better way. How to do that, I have no idea how to do that, since I am not a woman. I do know a way, but I am sure a crew cut just wouldn't fit with most women mind set. Although, I have seen some women have serious HIGH and Tights that look amazing and possibly too BUTCH. At any rate, medium fades all around. Carry on, LGOPS.
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Its about time we get with the program lol, it takes a few minutes to shave a beard " in case we have to done our pro mask" lol
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Can I have cute little highlights in my hair? I am not serious! I think we should enforce the standards we have, and I say no to beards.
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SGT Drew Hilliard
I agree. I was at the old guard where all soldiers were required by reg policy to have no hair showing below the cap line every monday. The Old Guard is the face of the Army to the entire world. If we set the standard at that level when civilians see soldiers out of regs it just looks bad. We didnt sign up to be the 1% to have free choices like civilians do. You signed to be something better. You signed to be an ideal for the civilian side to strive to become. Not the other way around.
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I know there are a lot of leaders that would appreciate not having to confront some women on their facial hair.<br>"Tell someone they have a great beard; She loses her mind."<br>then there is the fact it is the Sikh thing to do. http://www.army.mil/article/36339/<br><br>I think that there is also a culturally normative appearance that helps when working in, around or among certain global cultures.<br>
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SSG (Join to see)
males aren't allowed to have side burns past a certain length, but you always see some females with sideburns down to their lower jaw bone,,, and god help you if you say something about it. It should be the same. I've yet to hear a good reason as to why it's ok for females but not males.
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LTC Jason Bartlett
The earlier discussion is why I presented the question. Seen a lot of good responses so far. I wouldn't mind a beard or longer hair now that I am older and have more respect for hair.
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SFC (Join to see)
the double buns (I think you may have seen my thread SSG Goicoechea) also fit well in my gas mask and with my PC. I say no facial hair for women (hey, I am italian, I get fuzz and I have to get waxed - don't judge) but I don't want to cut my hair :( I wouldn't care if the guys grew theirs out.... I think they look more intimidating with facial hair and long hair!
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CMDCM Gene Treants
If you have ti wear an oversized cover, if you have to ask, then you already know the answer.
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