Posted on Jul 14, 2015
GySgt Warehouse Chief (3051)
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I'm curious to know what job opportunities are available to retired E8's and E9's. I know for retired officers, civilian executive level positions will probably be calling after a successful military career. Have any E8's and E9's gone on to pursue a successful civilian career in executive level leadership?
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LTC George J Salerno
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Edited >1 y ago
I am going to offer you the same advice I gave to someone asking a similar question as an officer, as the issues are the same. It is the same perspective. Here is what I said (with additional input):
"Understand exactly from where you are coming (I'm still there after 5 years). The civil sector does not know what to do with retirees. The do not understand nor value the managerial and leadership experience. Unless you have a sure hook in the government sector, you won't get in to the GS13-15 positions that match the military experiences of an LTC (E7-E9 either). In the private sector, they have no idea as they are ignorant of the skill sets of most military (I say this academically, not provocatively).
For those retiring, I offer this advice I wish I did. You do not need a job right away. You are blessed in having the retirement and won't starve or lose a house (though personal variables differ). Take the time to learn what you want to do for the rest of your next career. If you take a job because you need or think you need it, that will be the industry in which you will be labeled (i.e. I took a gov't job as a QA Specialist, that was my label until I worked for a bank in Bus Continuity; that became my label.)
Networking is the other key. Meet civilians and find some of their networking groups. As a lot of question; do informational interviews. You may find someone who served who will take a chance.
The transition is not easy for most. In my mind, the goal is to find what you want to do rather than need (unless you truly do need)."
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SPC Paul Jennings, J.D.
SPC Paul Jennings, J.D.
10 y
My wife retired from the Army medically as a CPT, no "hook" with the federal government at all. She landed a GS-13 job within 90 days of leaving the service. If you're flexible and know how to properly apply for the positions, there are plenty of government jobs available for senior enlisted and officers.
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1SG Ernest Oberst
1SG Ernest Oberst
8 y
As a retired Infantryman, I chose to go back to school. At the University of South Carolina I have not only furthered my education but it helped me to ease into the strange world of the civilian!!
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Suzanne King Prior
Suzanne King Prior
8 y
My husband is retired E8 after 30 years of service. Recently lost his job and it's been two months and nothing. For someone with all of his skills and abilities and knowledge you'd think a company would be dying to hire him... unfortunately, however, he's not an officer and does not have a formal college degree. That seems to kill him every time. He shouldn't have to go back to school and pay thousands of dollars and years of his life to re-learn skills he already has. It's very frustrating.
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LTC George J Salerno
LTC George J Salerno
8 y
Suzanne- I agree wholeheartedly and share your frustration. The private sector does not respect the abilities of those retired; officer or Senior NCO. Having a degree doesn't seem to matter. I've been out of work for over a year; the second time in six years. Sometimes we need to look at "re-trading" ourselves to find our niche and what we want to do. I'm about to do it myself.
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MSG Jim Gawne
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I chose to pursue a non-executive position. After over 25 years of leading soldiers, I had no desire to be in leadership.
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MSG Senior Supply/Service Sergeant
MSG (Join to see)
>1 y
Good for you. I ended my Career as a MSGT at the ARCOM DCSLOG Senior NCO level. Had enough of the politics and pressure and got a job as a re-fuler at a local airport for $7.00 bucks an hour because I love airplanes. Didn't get rich, but loved my job. However that only lasted till the war began and my experience and services were needed at a GS position. The job required support of the troops, and I couldn't say no.
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LTC Hardware Test Engineer
LTC (Join to see)
10 y
If I had done all my time active duty and retired after 25 years as an E8-E9, I would just retire. E9 with 25 year will pull in `$3900/month ($2900 after taxes).
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MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
10 y
LTC (Join to see) - I retired at 20, Worked at Sears for $2.50 an hour. got call to Civil Service, worked my self up to GS-12 and a MBA. Gave them 20 and combined my time for 40 years as a GS-12. A couple of rental homes, Social Security, RMD, 100% disability and for the first time hit 6 figures. To old, bad health limits me to hunting and fishing. Set a goal you can reach and GO FOR IT. When you get there, set another one. You did it in the military and the outside is no different.
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
>1 y
It does reach a point where in Military and civilian jobs I was either the supervision or management with anywhere up to 500 people working under My supervision. Despite two retirements, which are My main source of income, I still work but at a stress free job where I'm not overlooking that number of people any longer and don't want to. i'm no longer trying to build a resume, My career is behind Me but I'm also not willing to roll over and play dead either. i keep busy and also spend a lot of time with the American Legion in my free time beside time with My Wife, adult off springs and also Grandchildren. Take care of My home and yard. Guess I squeeze in a little time here also. I read a lot as well, I'm never bored.
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MSgt Shawn Doyle
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My response to this question arises from my personal experience after retiring from the Air Force an E-7 and then looking towards the government civilian sector for a second career opportunity. I started my job search at least 9 months out from my terminal leave date and narrowing my opportunities to those jobs that could be closely related to the technical expertise that I developed while in the military; knowing that it would be these unique skills that I could and would offer an employer to help secure a position within the Federal Government. Though my resume was outlined with numerous leadership positions and highlighted with academic successes, I knew that getting my foot in the door would be my first priority and from there my career advancement would come at my own determination. I have found for the most part that there aren’t too many Federal Government positions that are available for retired or former military members at the higher GS levels (13-15). Most government agencies try to promote from within and there are many civil service employees that have been in the system for years (10-20-30) and they want to advance in their careers just like everyone else and many of them are former military members as well. So, thinking that I would jump to the top was just unrealistic, no matter what I could offer them in the leadership arena. I started my Federal career as a GS-9 just 3 months after my military retirement date and within a year I was a GS-11. Two years later I was a GS-12 and now just 7 years after retirement I’m a GS-13. For each promotion I had to compete for the position against all those who wanted the job and promotion as well, to include former senior NCOs and Officers. I have no doubt that the leadership skills I had developed while in the service contributed to my selections for those positions and promotions, but they were not the only factor. Therefore, I would highly recommend that for those E-7s, 8s and 9s that are looking towards the civil service sector for a second career opportunity, to focus on your technical skills as the primary attractor to a potential employer and then utilize your leadership abilities to advance forward.
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What job opportunities are out there for retired E8's and E9's?
CW4 Robert Goldsmith
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There are some very good responses to the question. One that must be asnwered is what level of comfort or discomfort do you want from your job after you retire? There is bureaucracy that you have to deal with. The higher up you are, then the more you'll deal with. Are you looking for job satisfaction or a paycheck? Most notably, your rank is irrelevant. I'm Robert, not "Chief!" That's a chapter in the story of your life, but there is life after the military. I have co-workers that range from junior enlisted to field grade officers and senior non-commisisoned officers. We all have the same objectives. We do our jobs to the best of our ability and take home a check and nice compensation in return for it. For those of you who don't know, a master's degree gets you into the federal door as a GS-9 and a PhD gets you in as a GS-11. But beware of which agency you join because some are not as well funded as others as far as job security is concerned. Go do some volunteer work. Take the kids to school if you have them. Take a mid -afternoon nap. Enjoy a vacation or two. If your spouse is working, take care of the household stuff. You'll find out that all of these things are rewarding to retirees. Then go look for a job you'll enjoy.
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CDR Kenneth Kaiser
CDR Kenneth Kaiser
10 y
Regarding civil service it depends what you do. If you are in a technical field you can get in the higher grades. For instance there are Systems commands, and development commands and other labs and agencies such as the intelligence services which also do development or other demanding tasks. Getting into those directly is a demanding task but they usually hire contractor support because the command itself cannot do production. Given that if you can get yourself hired by a contractor and build a relationship with the civil service force based upon good honest work and mutual respect sometimes this is an avenue to employment and usually since it is in a technical field the pay is good.
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MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
10 y
CDR Kenneth Kaiser - Exactly what my son-in-law is doing
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MSG Chief Executive Officer (Ceo)
MSG (Join to see)
>1 y
This is the best response hands down, Robert. 3 years and running. LoL! Thank you!
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CDR Kenneth Kaiser
CDR Kenneth Kaiser
>1 y
On the systems commands the pay is higher In San Diego the entry can be 12 or 13. I would think the key would be to establish a pay base working with a contractor and then once you have that established move to civil service who will match your pay. Certain portions of your service can be credited to civil service if you pay the retroactive social security which in my case was about 4K so you build your time rapidly. I got 9 years credit and in one year had my ten year pin. Your retirement is based upon the base pay plus the locality adjustment and your high three years. So San Diego added something like 15 % to your base pay.
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Asking the question in this manner makes you appear that you think you are entitled to a job just because you are a retired E8/E9. That will not get you a civilian job. However, if you look at the situation as "what career opportunities are available for a mid-level supervisor with 25+ of experience working in (pick one) Human Resources, Logistics, Operations, etc." and you'll likely be more successful with your employment search. Civilian employers want to know what abilities and capabilities you bring to a company. Frame your search and your pitch in what you can provide to the company based on your military experience, not what rank you earned, and I'd bet you'll find there are career opportunities for someone with an E8/E9's experience. Side note, be prepared to move where the opportunities are, not necessarily where you want to settle like in your hometown. Those who are willing to move, will find more opportunities. Good luck and thanks for serving.
LCpl Dan McTiernan
LCpl Dan McTiernan
>1 y
Great advice. A peer of mind and I were talking two weeks ago and he mentioned how in his firm he had a "kid" who was a go to guy. When they had challenges often managers recommended to others to "give it to the kid". Bob told me that one day he was talking to the "kid" and the kid stated that it was amazing how when he reported to duty as a Chief Master Sergeant how many people he was in charge of and yet at his civilian job he was the kid. I have recruited and had my recruiters at military job fairs, Lowry, SACC, and more. Often I had no idea what some service people were talking about in regards to their experiences, e.g., hiring a general manager for a port, (Pier 400 in Long Beach/LA), this is when standing in the aisle with my recruiter and port manager looking to qualify people to an entry level position paying about $70k+ needing people who can motivate and lead a team with potential for growth. Came away with one person who had interest.
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CDR Kenneth Kaiser
CDR Kenneth Kaiser
10 y
A slight variation on your advice they used to tell us put yourself in the hiring position and ask yourself what skills or qualities would you like to see in this individual you are going to hire. Are those highlighted or easily identifiable in your resume? The second standard piece of advice is to make a list of candidate firms or folks you would like to work for and start your process at the bottom of the list. As you move up your list you become more comfortable in the interview process and more knowledgeable about who is doing what to whom in the industry. By the time you are talking to the companies you want to work with you are polished comfortable and confident.
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MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
10 y
Hit the nail on the head. I had to move to Dayton, Ohio. Got a career training position to GS-12. Could have made GS-13 but,I wanted to get back to SA TX to finish my MBA. You have to go where the money is.
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SCPO Hospital Corpsman
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I know of several prior E8-E9’s that moved into executive management following their military career, Each achieved a degree before leaving the service and started communications with the companies that had the positions they were interested in. Upon finding the desired position they corresponded with the those executive managers in like positions they were interested in and began developing a post military transition plan ensuring they had:
• The right education
• Developed a study plan and finance plan to achieve certifications need for their future job
• Understanding company needs and how they could fill those needs
• Developed peer reviewed resumes and cover letters that reflected their careers removing military jargon.
• Researched and established location desires so they could direct their post military job search
• Researched the companies to understand the salaries being offered
• Researched and practice for interviews
Enlisted and officer have shared strengths and weaknesses entering the work force most work off an established budget and do not have to develop a strategic budget, when you show up to an interview the interview does not see the rank and awards that people recognize in the military as an achievement. They have to sell themselves and what they can do for the company bottom line.
Senior enlisted must understand the best time to plan isn’t after discharge—it’s right now. Get the needed education or certifications and research the markets they want to enter and find a career mentor.
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LCDR Judge Advocate General's Corps Officer
LCDR (Join to see)
>1 y
In addition to the excellent advice, you also need to show how adaptable you are to another organization. So losing the "Sir/Ma'am" and acronyms that only a service member / veteran would understand. If you haven't already, recommend checking out American Corporate Partners and get a mentor to help you civliianize your resume to highlight your valuable and exceptional service.

Recommend also getting out a Hire Our Heroes job fair.
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LCpl Dan McTiernan
LCpl Dan McTiernan
>1 y
LT Jen-efur Jayne, agree get rid of the acronyms, not in agreement with the Sir/Ma'am comment. I still use them. That respect shown in an interaction is noticed!
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MSgt Alex Taylor
MSgt Alex Taylor
>1 y
That is excellent advice for anybody transitioning out of the military, whether at 4 years or 30+.
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MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
10 y
Great advice. I got certified in Water and Waste Water Management. Got a job as WG-10 in Chemical treatment and climbed on up the ladder.
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CMSgt Lloyd French
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9
0
The first thing you need to do to successfully transition from the service and into an executive role is to have AT LEAST a 4-year degree and preferably a Master's Degree...these educational credentials are the ones most officers possess when they retire from the service. Next, dive into your network. Get on LinkedIn, post a well-worded resume on as many sites as possible, buy a NICE suit and tie, and go to job fairs dressed like that. You will be amazed at the outfits some people wear to job fairs. If you attend a job fair, be social with the people around you, with the people at the tables, and know which companies you want to talk to BEFORE you get there. I've been in executive positions for all 8 years of my retirement (E9)...I did this by following my own advice...and preparing for my transition to civilian life well ahead of the event. I wish you EVERY success!
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LCpl Dan McTiernan
LCpl Dan McTiernan
>1 y
Note the many references to networking, it works! Degrees are typically required for most if not all managerial positions.
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MSgt Mike Brown; MBTI-CP;  MA, Ph.D.
MSgt Mike Brown; MBTI-CP; MA, Ph.D.
>1 y
The philosophy of "The Job Fair" seems to have dissipated to colleges recruiting from the soon-to transition pool, and from what I have experienced, it as become ever-increasingly more difficult to have a conversation with organizational representative at a job fair -- whether they represent federal or private sector positions -- it seems to return to a recruiter's fair for colleges.
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GySgt Carl Rumbolo
GySgt Carl Rumbolo
10 y
Not all 'leadership' positions are management positions. The two are not necessarily the same thing. I have held both management and leadership positions - I prefer leadership. In organizations, there are opportunities to be a 'leader' without being a manager.

Often, particularly in enterprises with strong technical requirements, for example information technology, technical leaders often have as much 'influence' as managers (often more) and are very often at a higher pay scale.

I use information technology as an example, because today the concept of a company as being information technology centers is not on the surface. If you have seen the GE commercials - GE is not an industrial manufacturer, as much as an information technology company that does industrial manufacturing. Banks are financial services companies, but in today's world, they are also information technology companies (a bank without IT isn't a functioning bank).
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SMSgt Tony Barnes
7
7
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A retired AF CMSgt I know is an HR director in DC of a defense contract company. But, he got his HR degrees. Most E8s and E9s will not walk right into executive leadership...nor will a Top Secret mean much other than getting you into the door of applying. I was a defense contract recruiter for a while when I first retired. E8s and E9s have quick wakeup calls that they aren't quite the hot commodity they thought they were. Be willing to take something less and there are great opportunities.
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SMSgt Tony Barnes
SMSgt Tony Barnes
10 y
Well my chief friend got s pink slip the other day. Firm hadn't won a contract in 3 years.
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MGySgt Clint Pearman
7
7
0
Edited >1 y ago
Start your own business. This is far simpler for Senior Enlisted then you can imagine. If you got to E-8 or -E-9, you already possess the success skills to succeed in your own business. Notice I did not say leadership or management those are different skill sets and the civilian world looks at college education for those skills. But what you can't get in college is success skill. Success skills are what E-8 and E-9 possess. Success skills are things like ability to focus, persistence, setting goal, developing a plan, and not quitting until you succeed. The biggest problem with senior enlisted vets is their fair of the unknown associated with starting your own business, however, this is why you get a business coach or success coach. I operate or have operated a successful radio show, professional speaking business, life coaching business, leadership development company, a nationwide network of health and wellness coaching business, and wrote two books. Now I'm thinking of starting a Senior Enlisted Small Business Startup Success Coaching Practice. Hummm
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1SG Jeffery D Bell
1SG Jeffery D Bell
10 y
Nice!!!
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1SG Stephen Willis
7
7
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Find a way to work for yourself. Entrepreneurship is the way to make things happen for your family. Remember, a restaurant is the quickest way to poverty. Couple friends proved that statement.
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1px xxx
Suspended Profile
>1 y
There are jobs out there. I have compiled resumes and submitted for executive positions that I am fully qualified for and also mid level analyst positions that I currently accepted in Germany. Dependent on your background many managerial consultant jobs and supervisory jobs available in numerous job markets. If your looking at GS, I have not been able to crack that shell yet.
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
10 y
Keep trying and good luck.
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