Posted on Apr 27, 2016
What would you do if your CSM was ignoring uniform and grooming standards? (CSM Flournoy)
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So this CSM from the the 8th MP BDE seems to be out of regulations. From the comments she has been corrected but she claims she is being harassed. I don't even understand how she got to be a CSM at a BDE. What COL out there is letting this happen? In one of the photos she is wearing stilettos in uniform. WTF? What kind of example is this. The worst is from a Facebook user that said:
"This one!!!! Holy **** she was in charge of us in Afghanistan!! I could go on and on about this toxic leader!! Trying to maintain professionalism but this one.....when a CSM so jacked up like this, she was laughing her ass off during our rehearsal of my brothers ceremony after he was killed in Afghanistan, she f***ing yelled at me because I "took too long saying my goodbye " as I'm f***ing crying kneeling in front of it. This post will probably get me in trouble, and ruin the rest of my army career as well as my day and my army experience."
What would you do if you were there? What if you were on command?
What should the Army do about this?
(Thanks to Army MP WTF Moments and it's followers for the photos.)
**************UPDATE************************
The 8th Theater Sustainment Command CSM will be travelling to the 8th MP BDE to have some one on one time with this CSM. It is amazing as leaders will do when they are being called out. He should have done that a long time ago.
"This one!!!! Holy **** she was in charge of us in Afghanistan!! I could go on and on about this toxic leader!! Trying to maintain professionalism but this one.....when a CSM so jacked up like this, she was laughing her ass off during our rehearsal of my brothers ceremony after he was killed in Afghanistan, she f***ing yelled at me because I "took too long saying my goodbye " as I'm f***ing crying kneeling in front of it. This post will probably get me in trouble, and ruin the rest of my army career as well as my day and my army experience."
What would you do if you were there? What if you were on command?
What should the Army do about this?
(Thanks to Army MP WTF Moments and it's followers for the photos.)
**************UPDATE************************
The 8th Theater Sustainment Command CSM will be travelling to the 8th MP BDE to have some one on one time with this CSM. It is amazing as leaders will do when they are being called out. He should have done that a long time ago.
Posted in these groups: 
CSM
Grooming Standards
CSM Grooming Standards
Edited >1 y ago
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Responses: 918
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8th TSC will send someone, then a slap on the hand followed by about two months of fixed behavior, followed by repetitive nature of infractions, and the conspiracy to cover it up begins again. Here's the BLUF she has been like this for YEARS and it's an endless cycle. At the end she will retire, with 100% benefits regardless of AR 670-1 being a punitive article anyways, and she will have done what she wanted during 20+ years and still get away with it regardless. She is an attention seeker and that's what she is getting at this movement, so she's happy and there's nothing we can do about it. Just like her there many other people doing the same thing and it won't stop until senior people than them grow the internal fortune to say something. But hey, we can always dream that's going to happen right?
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SFC John Martin
MAJ (Join to see) - I sure hope not Sir. They are available to go to other BG or MG billets.
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MAJ (Join to see)
SFC John Martin - That was just the first MP-specific GO-level E9 slot I thought of. Maybe a Division or Corps HQ Provost Marshall SGM? Or I suppose a TSC/ESC, or some branch immaterial slot.
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MSG (Join to see)
Office of the Provost Marshal General, it's a MG billet in Washington. Oversees all MP, corrections and CID functions in The Army. That would be a good assignment for her. Lots of brass to keep her in check.
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SSG (Join to see)
Because she has now served in a Brigade billet she is eligible to be Regimental CSM now
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CPT Russell Pitre Is the SMA's assistant still monitoring Rally Point? Will 'smoke' rain down upon this ridiculous example? When? By whom? Will 'they' announce that action has been imitated?
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CPT Russell Pitre
I thought he was on it himself. I am sure that he knows now. Now her boss in on the way to see her tomorrow. I am sure he got a few phone calls. I am wondering what the COL in the BDE is thinking about this.
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CSM Charles Hayden Passed 7/29/2025
Please keep us posted if any action is taken! CPT Russell Pitre CPT Russell Pitre
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MAJ (Join to see)
I don't know if SGM Parsons is on RP. I do know he will not shy away from corrections. Even if it was just my deadlift form.
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It is the responsibility of the BDE CDR to address those issues that I'm sure he or she was aware of as well as her next higher CSM. Unfortunately she has probably had those standards most of her career.
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CPT Russell Pitre
Now the CSM of her higher unit is on the way to have some one on one time with her. Now.
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SGM Joel Cook
Well said SFC Roberto Garza Jr. Well said, I have been thinking about what would have happened to me as a Caucasian, blonde haired, blue eyed SGM if I ever did this kind of crap. The answer "Investigation to substantiate the brow beating of juniors who corrected her, if justified relief for cause with substandard NCOER. Asked to retire at soonest opportunity. I have already seen two posts on here that she is on the warpath screaming Harressment. Next she will be looking for revenge on who posted this item.
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I am ex U.S. Army and this is clearly in violation of the UCMJ! The UCMJ governs the uniform and conduct standards of the U.S. Armed forces. Someone needs to call the I.G.'s office and inform them so that there can be a formal investigation into these allegations. In the Military, especially the Army everything must go through proper channels. In my honest opinion, IF these things are correct, then YES she needs to be reprimanded and reminded of the proper dress codes as well as codes of conduct for soldiers. That is why we have a UCMJ. Now it's not as serious as espionage or other such betrayal of our nation, however it is serious coming from someone in leadership roles over soldiers. Normally if a lower enlisted man or woman conducted themselves in this manner they would be warned, then a counseling session would ensue as well as a formal "write up." and then if the soldier refused the reprimand and did not comply, an Article 15 is issued and proper punishment is given. Article 15 provides for infractions that are not worthy of full legal actions such as any actual criminal activity. Article 15 is what they would use. Now coming from someone in a role of a command, I am not sure if it is different for them. The old saying goes though; "Lead by example."
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SSG (Join to see)
The UCMJ does not govern personal appearance or the wear of uniforms. Each branch has their own regulations. For the U.S. Army, it is AR670-1 "Wear and Appearance of Uniforms and Insignia". Every soldier, no matter rank or leadership role, has to follow that regulation. It's literally "By Order of the Secretary of the Army". The only ones it does not apply to, according to the order itself, is the Chief of Staff of the Army and to former Chiefs of Staff of the Army. Apparently, they can prescribe their own uniform.
Also, there are parts of the AR670-1 which are punitive which can result in adverse admin and/or charges under the UCMJ.
I took most of this info right from the signature page of the AR670-1.
Also, there are parts of the AR670-1 which are punitive which can result in adverse admin and/or charges under the UCMJ.
I took most of this info right from the signature page of the AR670-1.
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Isn't the SENIOR ENLISTED supposed to set the example of what TO do, rather then what NOT to do? Knock her down a rank, for Conduct Unbecoming.
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It's a shame that an E-9 walks around looking like a shitbird instead of showing the troops on how an enlisted leader should look, behave and be a role model for junior enlisted people
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Thanks for bringing this discussion to my attention....this is one sad and unbelievable story....it is difficult for me to believe that this is the same US Army that I served in in VN....to allow this person to rise in the ranks...especially the NCO Corp is beyond comprehension....all the individuals along the chain of command that had anything to do with promoting this individual should be ashamed of their weakness in recognizing the lack of qualification that this individual has....get this person out of the system!
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This is so important that I think it should be referred to the IG for resolution. I was assigned to the IG for a couple of years and twice we forced a retirement of E-9's for similar problems while I was there. In both cases they were well researched before our recommendations went forward. When this kind of action is going and the existing command structure has not dealt with issue it is time to raise it to the next level.
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First of all it's obvious the unit has no leadership or she wouldn't be appearing like she is in a Hollywood movie lot. She is a disgrace to be in uniform. The morale in this unit has to be terrible to see a CSM's appearance to be acceptable by the chain of command.
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SGM Bill Preston
If I had the authority I would relieve the Commander & the CSM. The removal would tell the troops that disregarding regulations and standards are unacceptable regardless of rank or position. It is the duty of all NCO's to ensure military standards of appearance are followed and to lead by example.
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CPT Larry Hudson
I would relieve the command officer the CSM serves, issue the CSM a reprimand and or reduction of rank.
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