Why does the Army appear to have a discipline issue with the lower enlisted ranks?

Top, here is where discipline starts and that is at home when a child is a toddler. Responsibiliity is handed to them in Elementary School age a little at a time with increasing intensity. Jr High is "no excuse" time and high school is here are the requirements and this is what happens when you don't meet that requirement. When young people grow up understanding that when parents ask their children to do something that is not a wish, that's an order. When my daughter used to ask why she could not or had to do something her Mother's reply was, "'Cause I'm the Mother, that's why." Love and adore your kids but understand they are not your "drinking buddies", you are the PARENT. Your job is to teach them to survive. Watch the animals with their young and you'll get a good lesson in parenting. While they are youung is to make them understand what "penalties" are about. Your job Top is to square them away otherwise you'll be visiting them in jail or they become misfits in society much less the military. You run the Company, take no crap from anyone and let the folks know what the rules are PERIOD and what the consequences are for stepping over the line. When I was a young E-Nobody I thoght my Chief walked on the water, talked to God and had coffee with Him. Giving The Chief a ration of do-do was bad ju-ju. My Dad a retired MSGT squared me away, no excuses. So parents need to do the same thing. Babies when they are born only know two things and they are, "I'm cold and I'm hungry" the rest they learn from us. Unfortunately Top, we wind up being the surrogate Mommies and Daddies 'cause their parents would not take responsibility for their creation.

I guess I am a dinosaur. Thanks to COVID-19, I just spent 11 months at Pearl Harbor babysitting my grand daughter for my active duty daughter. I think discipline is both better and worse in the military than my day. We were perpetually politically incorrect when compared to civilian standards and firm believers in the 3rd paragraph of Naval Regulations. (Thiese regulations are meant as a guide. You may deviate at your own peril) As an LPO, my daughter's greatest challenge is to avoid offending her subordinates. Currently, there appears to be two channels of military discipline with the UCMJ being superceded by command SOP/regulations rather than being paramount. My daughter was continually facing conflict with a peer who would stop at nothing to make her look bad. When I told her to request mast, she said it would never be "approved". I was amazed a request mast could be disapproved. In my day, disapproval was not an option. When I told her to write up her adversary for conduct unbecoming for lying about situations to have my daughter counter manded, conduct unbecoming was a foreign concept to her.

<--- Active '74-'85
Lack of discipline has a number of causes; one of which is the overall 'culture' within a command structure. When I enlisted with the Army Security Agency (ASA) in '74 I spent a year stateside going to school (AIT), where everyone adhered to uniform dress code; often with varying levels of success, but at least the effort was made.

At my first posting however, a West German border site, an entirely different standard applied; uniforms were soft because nobody ironed or starched a uniform; boots looked like rawhide because shoe polish was unheard-of; men had hair on their collars & week-old 5 o'clock shadows, and women had ponytails or braids down between their shoulder blades; "respect" was accorded based upon how well one did one's job, regardless of rank. I should note that at the time the Army had two career paths - NCO, and Specialist. It was not unusual to see a Specialist/E7. NCO track had specific 'command authority', while Specialists were more 'technicians', with much less emphasis on command. The overall structure of the ASA was that the Army paid us, but the NSA told us where to go and had operational control. Most civilians at the time didn't give two farts about 'military discipline'; consequently, neither did we.

After a break in service, I rejoined what had become the Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM) which had undergone a major shift in culture because everyone had been "brought back into the fold" of military structure.

Another degradation of military discipline stems from being promoted to supervisory positions without the personal experience of dealing with infractions. Rather than discipline the rule-breaker, the newly-minted NCO would try to just ignore the infraction. Other soldiers in the platoon would see this example and loosen their own personal standards. Even worse, other soldiers - when promoted - would let this example inform/guide their interactions with their own subordinates.

Respectfully, all branches have this problem. Served in the army and navy, and people just haven't been prepared to follow orders. You have to insist and remind them of the nuclear option, obey my orders or you will go to jail. Worked for me!

hmmm... imo... the Army lost its discipline near the end of Vietnam, when Mommies cried to their Congress that their babies were being treated with disrespect by their Drill Sargents...
Words that insulted and demeaned recruits were banned.
Discipline eroded by whiny BS from people who raised their hands and swore to fight for this Nation...
and expected to not see combat, so discipline meant nothing...
WE HAVE TO BE FRIENDS WITH OUR SUBORDINATES, OR THEY FEEL BAD?
WAR DOESN'T CARE ABOUT THAT.
WAR DESTROYS ALL, REGARDLESS OF FRIENDSHIP.
WAR DEMANDS THAT SOLDIERS WILL HAVE COMBAT DISCIPLINE, OR THEY WILL DIE >(

Until Desert Storm... and a friendly enemy attacked U.S. for saving their oil for them... who Thanked U.S. for shoving Hussein back into Iraq... by sending their Princes to attack U.S. with Jumbo Jets... killing over 3000 U.S. CIVILIANS!

What did we do to Japan, when they sneak attacked U.S. killing nearly 3000 people at Pearl Harbor?
WE ANNIHILATED HIROSHMA AND NAGASAKI, AND SAID "TOKYO IS NEXT IF YOU DON'T SURRENDER RIGHT NOW!"
Now that enemy owns our Auto and Electronics Industries... BY LAW.
Enemy Britain owns our Oil, which they spill all over this Nation... BY LAW.
Enemy China owns our clothing, toys, appliances, metals, AND OUR FOOD PROCESSING!!!!
--> YES! OUR ENEMY... CHINA.... OWNS OUR FOOD PROCESSING... AT THE COMMAND OF OUR TRAITOR CONGRESS!
Trump was NOT Impeached for Colluding with Russia... if you watched, you know the Dems SCREAMED WITH HIGH DRAMA, that CHINA IS THE ENEMY! RUSSIA IS THE ENEMY! NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW! WE'RE AFRAID TRUMP WILL HELP CHINA!!
--> Reality Check: Trump was refusing to help China, by refusing to sign the Trade Deal that now gives China OUR DAIRY PRODUCTS... BY LAW... and we the people now drink CHINESE WATER BUFFALO MILK... While China's children now enjoy our Dairy Cow Milk >(
The Invaders, that our public servants claim are "non-legal aliens", now own our Fast Food Restaurants, and poison U.S. daily with their hate for all things U.S. ... as they enjoy all the blessings of our Liberty... AS INVADERS... BY LAW >(
--> "non-legal" alien = ILLEGAL... CRIMINAL... INVADER.

Now... we love our enemies, and protect them with OUR LIVES?

... and we retaliated against the Saudi King's Sons who sneak attacked U.S. on 9/11/2001 by... PROTECTING THEM FROM U.S.???

ROTFLMAO...
DISCIPLINE IS GONE, UNTIL YOU THE SOLDIERS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA CHOOSE TO PROTECT U.S. FROM OUR ENEMIES... INSTEAD OF GETTING ON YOUR KNEES TO THEM >(
--> THE FIRST ENEMY THAT NEEDS TO BE PUNISHED IS:
THE 6000 PUBLIC SERVANTS OF THE U.S. WHO ARE LEGISLATING FOR, AND ADHERING TO...
--> EVERY ENEMY IN U.S. HISTORY >(

There can be no discipline until the "entitled" generation comes to the understanding they are entitled to be SLAVES... IF THEY DON'T WORK TO PRESERVE THEIR FREEDOM, AND COUNTRY ... WITH THEIR LIVES IF NECESSARY!

Right now... with the Democratic National Socialist Fascist Dictator Party in control of the U.S. ...
I do believe we have already lost, and only our Military can resolve that.

But you choose to whine, instead of fighting for OUR FREEDOM AND DEMOCRACY...
SAD.
We are Conquered, just as Khrushchev promised... FROM WITHIN... WITHOUT A SHOT BEING FIRED!

Discipline? There will be no discipline until the conquerors declare themselves to be the Law of the U.S. and the whips start falling on your backs... AND THOSE WHO DO NOT FALL TO THEIR KNEES AND WORSHIP THEIR RULERS... WILL DIE... disciplined with the whips of RULERS.
Then you will realize why discipline and loyalty are required of all soldiers who fight for freedom.

All will ignore this, or hate me for this Truth...
I don't care... I have only one fight left to fight... my death from old age... I WILL lose.
It's your lives now... not mine...
YOU ARE YOUNG... LIVE IN FREEDOM... OR OPPRESSION???
MAKE YOUR OWN CHOICES...
BUT CHOOSE WISELY!!!

As a civilian worker I have seen a lot of discipline problems a lot of disrespect and a lot of just lotta BS that a lot of the younger military has shown I am not going to classify which branch I see it as a whole. I would not mind talking with you off of here about this if you’d like to see a lot of trainees I work for the military and I wouldn’t mind giving you my opinion which would only be an opinion not a fact but the white but what I see and what I experienced when I was in the army is a total 100° turn around. Let me know if you want to talk

Social engineering!

There are numerous ideals, however you must select a suitable decision to deal with the soldier. Back in the days we were taught as young corporal through to the highest rank how to use your ability to motivate a soldier in anyway shape of form. Even as Drill Sergeants we taught how to deal with soldier at each level. You also must train your younger NCO's on how to deal with smart mouth by applying special details for them to learn to control their mouth. Not all the time are Article 15's and extra duty is going to work . It must be able to use some type of psychology in order to get the soldier attention and maintain that as long as that soldier is assigned to your platoon or section. A lot of these kids have bad home training at home or was raised by their mother's, due to father 's were nowhere around to raised them as gentlemen. At last counseling once every 30 or 10 days shall be use to show the soldier behavior improvements.

I began my career in the Marine Corps and later joined the Army. The difference in discipline begins when you stand on those yellow footprints upon arrival to Marine boot camp. Pride and discipline is instilled relentlessly. It never stops. One of the reasons I left the Marine Corps was the feeling of "endless bootcamp". There is a price to pay for the stric discipline.....it gets old! On the other hand, lack of discipline leads to chaos. I suppose there is a happy medium somewhere but I'm not certain where it lies. I would chafe at times when called "Chief". It was was rendered so nonchalantly. If I called a Marine WO "Gunner", I'd better know him well or all H would break loose. Same applied for "Gunney" for a Gunnery Sergeant. You'd think a salute or a "Sir" is implying servitude. If we want discipline and respect we have to instill it in basic training and continue it at the unit level. However, the respect has to go both ways. If a Soldier doesn't feel mutual respect and know we have his 6, we can't expect his in return.

Maybe a look is needed at how basic training is being conducted in the army.

Its called poor leadership.

I think something that the Army is missing is Army history. Soldiers don't know WHY they should be proud of the the service they chose to serve in. I served in the Navy Sea Cadets as a kid before joining and medically retiring from the Army. While we were just kids in the Sea Cadets, we were expected to intimately know Navy history and why we should be proud of the Navy. I got ZERO Army history in basic training in 1994. I know nothing about the Army such as when it was officially founded or great events in the past or anything at all for that matter. I was infinitely more proud of the Navy as a Sea Cadet than I was of the Army as an actual soldier. Don't get me wrong, I am proud to have served and I believe that the Army has many redeeming qualities, but it's just not taught. Ask any Marine the birthday of the Marines, ask any sailor for a quote from a famous sailor or tide turning battle, (sorry I don't know anything comparable for the Air Force), and you get the answer you're looking for. Ask a soldier something from Army history and you get crickets--*chirp chirp*. The Army needs to spend quality time in basic training teaching the soldiers Army history and Army pride. Along with that, those who can't grasp that concept simply need to be kicked to the curb.

I had a gunnie explain it to me this way.in the army before you go into combat.you get a hot meal.2 beers 8 hour sleep.I'm the marine corps they shit on bread give it to you.then you go into combat

I saw this issue beginning at my last assignment before I retired. I followed it as my stepson did his time,(medically retired) and have watched in the news and Army sites over the years. One reason was the "DEATH" of the truly professional NCO Corps. It became everyone was worthy of promotion whether they actually were or not and a lot of those sergeants had no loyalty to the military or their own soldiers/leaders. I've read stories of sergeants who could not zero or qualify with their individually assigned weapons let alone have no MOS proficiency. The bottom line is that politics and a undetermined time at war has seriously undermined the discipline and respect I not only taught my soldiers and those around us but gave way completely to individual pride instead of Esprit de Corps. Sadly I wonder what it will take before our senior leaders tell their civilian counterparts that yes right are important for all servicemembers but not at the cost of professionalism and discipline. Judt take a look at the news, suicides, murders and defections are the norm now. In all of my 20 years of service I never thought this would happen.

The last administration deliberately sought to undermine US combat prestige, Pastel uniforms for target designation...we still won, ROEs requiring the enemy to close before engagements we still won... Introduction to sensitivity training and integration of the sexes in all combat arms, they'll bury a lot in China. with the watered down training and standards .I wonder if they even PMCS on vehicles anymore ...because it's TOO heavy and uncomfortable.

When I was at AIT the Army's primary schoolschooling. Some soldiers to be high schoolish.
Now you can drink all the beer you can drink.
But I also saw the First Sgt stand before the Company and preach to us about the wrongs of drinking then get drunk as a skunk at a Company's party. Then go to church and preach to the soldiers about the sins of drinking. He also jumps on soldiers for getting too drunk.
So young soldiers and older soldiers will get drunk and make a fool out of themselves.
I've learned that no matter at what age soldiers will get drunk.
In Germany on a Mountain Top, the young soldiers would get drunk because they could. One soldier almost died because of alcohol poisoning. I had to take her to a German Hospital for treatment.
I learned that if I was going to drink it would be in my home. But never again would i get drunk.

CPT

Everything start back in 1987
When I was a Drill Sergeant a team of doctor visit my unit and interviewed all the Drill Sergeant asking what was the motive for us to implement harsh discipline on new recruits. All of us give our reasons of why discipline implemented in the early stage will mold a soldier to follow orders without hesitation. About couple months later the Army implement new rules such as soldier can’t be doing PT before 6:00am and so on
Now years later good leaders has to put out with indiscipline soldiers

Having served in the Marine Corps and the Army, there is a dramatically different approach to discipline. In the Corps, there is little interaction between enlisted and NCO's. The junior enlisted know little about their NCO's which works well when orders are given and executed. The Army, on the other hand, allows some fraternization in the ranks between NCOs and enlisted. It makes for a more relaxed atmosphere. At the end of the day, orders are given, received, and executed.
In addition, I've found Army soldiers have their MOS down cold and are much better at their field skills than Marines.

Is it true the Army has a "Time Out Card"?

I've seen the discipline of soldiers decline with each generation. When spanking in schools were taken away the discipline also declined.
In the late 70's the government was trying to pass that children can turn parents in for spanking them. This is when parents didn't know how to discipline their children, didn't want to get reported especially by their children.
As 21st century comes along, discipline is out the window. Some soldiers are disciplined while others just don't care.
And the Military has both types in their ranks.