Posted on May 28, 2015
SSgt Security Forces
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I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Edited 10 y ago
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Sgt Anthony Leverington
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I don't know how things are these days and I can't speak for other bases but when I was active (1985-1989), we had to requalify every year with the M-16. Our range wasn't long enough to place the targets 1,000 yards away so, they compensated by having us shoot from 100 yards away at a silhouette that was 1/10th normal size. All hits had to be within the center mass area to qualify for expert. I grew up shooting much larger caliber rifles so, hitting the target with an M-16 was a breeze. Additional training included field stripping, cleaning and reassembly. It may have had something to do with the fact that our base was the 1st SOW. I was in the 834th AGS attached to the 20th SOS. In addition to our M-16 training and qualification, my unit had to go through special training to be able to service and maintain the helicopters while hot (loaded) guns were installed.
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SSgt Ian Arnold
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Apparently things have changed. I worked in Ammo and carried an M-16 during exercises and certainly during Desert Storm. I’ve been out for 28 years and don’t understand why it changed.
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SPC Harold Decoteau
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It wouldn't hurt!
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SSgt Fire Team Leader
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I understand what you mean. There have been a number of publications about airbase defense doctrine and ID (Integrated Defense) in particular. The ID concept is a page right out of the Army and Marine Corps playbooks: every Airman is responsible for defending the airbase, not just SF, not the Army, not the Marine Corps, unless of course it’s a joint base (which it likely would be, and in that case Soldiers and Marines are responsible for base defense as well). The Air Force has done a lot of chest beating in recent years about fighting in contested battle space, and basing on hostile turf. Yet, when it comes to actually mentally and physically preparing Airmen to survive and function in a true contested battlefield environment, it doesn’t really pan out. There’s still far too many Airmen who aren’t in fighting shape, and wouldn’t know how to handle a weapon if the S hit the fan. I understand in investing in our Airmen to be the best mechanic, pilot, port dawg, loggie, etc. but I also believe that they need to be given the tools and training to survive in a contested environment long enough to do their primary job. Even just one week of combat training per year (small unit tactics, rifle range, TCCC) would be an improvement, especially in light of this great war that’s supposedly on the horizon. But alas, the Air Force won’t change things until they have to, (i.e. people start getting killed.
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PO3 Edward Ludwig
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I was in the 934th TAC US Air Force we had firearm training & qualified with the M 16 at the firing range shooting in all positions
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AB Roger Zauner
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Edited 4 y ago
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SSgt James Martin
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I was trained as a aircraft electrician. I qualified expert on the m1, the m16 and the 38 pistol as part of my advanced training prior to going to Vietnam, 1967/68. I was required to carry rifle and pistol on the flight line. I had to use them a number of times. I never met anyone who couldn't use these weapons. I agree all in the military should have some cross training.
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SMSgt Bob W.
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This argument again. Get real, get a new topic. In 2025 Nike will be making a footwear for all services. It will be called "Space Jerks".
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SSgt Steven Imlay
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I don't know how it is now but when I went in everybody got some training on the M-16 and had to fire it at the range. After that if you weren't in sec police or law enforcement it was unlikely you would ever touch one again. As an instructor we did train CES on weapons and included them in air base ground defense as back up. Now all of that may have changed but we were told when I went into security police that we would no longer have the army to protect our bases. We would have to do it ourselves. That was the 1970s and 80s.
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SMSgt Jeff Kyle
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I started out in the Marine Corps. I went through all the training including my MOS training: 6113, CH-53A/D helicopter mechanic. I also trained up the become a plane captain and a Crew Chief. I wasn’t the best shooter by far but I qualified as every Marine was required. Every Marine is a rifleman, that is true. Every Marine is not a 0311 Infantry. Two separate MOS’s doing completely different jobs. I got out after four years. Civilian light sucks, period. I hated being one and tried to get back into the Marines. Didn’t happen. Instead I joined the Air Force. I went direct duty to my first Air Force assignment as a HH-53B/C crew chief. Please note the difference between my spelling of the words crew and chief. In the Marines, Crew Chief was a title. We wore gold Aircrew wings and we flew and worked on our assigned helicopters exclusively. In the Air Force, crew chief is a job. The differences were minor as far as the job went. Rotor heads, engines, hydraulics, airframe, etc. there was no differences between the services. The difference was the culture. We were Marines. When we ran out of helicopters, they issued us a rifle and we headed for whatever and wherever we were needed. I was a corporal (E-4). I was an NCO. I would have been totally lost if I had to lead Marines in ground combat. The Air Force confused the heck out of me. I can honestly say I never fully figured out everything about being an Airman. I served in the Air Force for 21 years and retired as a SMSgt.

At some point in war, the enemy can be expected to do the unexpected. They attack at your weakest point. They people on the flight line, in the back shops, in all the various shops and offices would be lost in ground combat. Yes, we have Security Forces. I battalion of enemy troops would put a hurt locker on an Air Force Base. SF Airman posted on the perimeter of a base are going fight. They are warriors in every sense of the word. They are also a finite resource. Use up all you SF repelling an attack, who’s going to fill in those positions on the perimeter?

I’ve said it before and I’ll repeat it: training an Airman on the basics of infantry combat during basic training is a force multiplier. Without this training, the enemy will have a target rich environment. And I’m not talking about places like Afghanistan where the enemy is fighting a gorilla war. I’m talking about places like Korea.

Anyway, that’s my opinion, hopefully I made a bit of sense.
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Cpl Germaine Diehl
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My daughter is officer in Air Force and she was raised like myself with using weapons. She knows we need them.
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Cpl Germaine Diehl
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Same. Everyone should have and be able to use a weaponon our home front for protection. We have to stop being close minded and nieve that it is not necessary. I’m a marine and I even grew up using weapons. But I guess my parents were special thinkers like me. Out of the freakin BOX people.
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Maj Martin Smith
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In August of '65 before going to Vietnam I had to qualify on a M-16. I was at the now defunct Kincheloe AFB, MI. First time I had an AF weapon in my hands since OTS .38 revolver qualifying in November of '63. Something changed obviously.
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SSgt Ray Bebee
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Why do the army, navy and marines have combat airplanes and helicopters? Why don't they leave the flying to the Air Force? Then the navy can have their boats and the army and marines can protect the Air bases and do combat.
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CPO Arthur Weinberger
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I wish all services would require service members to be proficient with all aspects of small arms.
Self defense and physical fitness should be part of all branches. Unfortunately the above is not.SSG I concur completely. have a great year.
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SFC William Linnell
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The first I was aware of this was in training to be a Combat Adviser. We had a mixed bag of Navy, AF and Army. The AF and Navy couldn't shoot for jack. I agree with you whole heartedly. As huge as AF bases are, you SF guys will not be able to cover it all with enough firepower. It's a failure in Leadership.

After coming back from Afghanistan, I was back at the school house training more advisers. They still couldn't shoot for shit but they followed instructions way better then the Army National Guard and active duty Army.
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TSgt Don Dollinger
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Other branches of the military are infantry first and comprise much of the fighting force. This is not the case with the Air Force. Air Power comes in, kicks ass, and gets out. The Air Frames are not required to to be maintained in the AOR thus the majority of the Air Force is not required in the AOR but safer areas out-of-country. I spent many years as NCOIC of deployments and any AF personnel deploying required to be M-16 proficient at a minimum and were issued weapon upon deployment. Our officers do the fighting, our enlisted maintain the weapon, the majority of AF personnel are down range with the Air Frames. AF personnel are usually not in a position to have to protect a location or assets but if it comes to that, they will be upto the task.
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PO2 Steven Michaeli
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When I was in the USAF, we had to qualify in basic. A couple years later that stopped. Then it was .22 conversation M16s. I was lucky, for several years I was an armed escort so I qualified on several weapons each year
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LTC Donell Kelly
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As a now retired member of the Army Nurse Corps, I can honestly say that in our AMEDD basic training in 1971 @ Camp Bullis, the only people more terrified than we were, were the range monitors assigned to stand both behind us & next to us. Their exemplary jobs, were to keep us from killing anything down range except the target w/a 9 mm weapon…or maybe it was a .45. In today’s Army, it is foolish beyond belief to not have AMEDD personnel successfully trained in both side arm & long gun proficiency. To not do so = personnel unable to defend themselves &/or their patients.
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SPC Robert Bobo
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Yep, doesn't make since, everyone should qualify with at least a Rifle annually
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