Posted on May 28, 2015
SSgt Security Forces
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Carbine backwards mag
I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Edited 9 y ago
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MAJ Steve Daugherty
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While I can see good reasons why an airman’s training might necessarily be different. I still think every service member should be familiar with the standard personal weapons of our armed forces . Shoot, I think every American should know how to use a firearm safely and properly. I think most Ukrainians would agree.
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SP5 James Elmore
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Except for certain groups in the AF, not much need. Besides, firefights can occur at any time and what airman wakes up before noon. The maid hasn't even come in yet.
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SP5 James Elmore
SP5 James Elmore
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I wonder what happened to the serious part of my comment. I said that I agree with you. I would not want to rely on others for personal protection in a combat zone like RVN should the perimeter be breached.
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CW3 James Ives
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Couldn't agree more.
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MSG Thomas Currie
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If the enemy "comes knocking on your doorstep" everyone else is going to rely on you and other security force personnel (who hopefully have completed Air Base Ground Defense training).

It wouldn't really help much if the Air Force bothered training everyone enough to qualify with a weapon because no air base has enough individual weapons to pass around or enough qualified leaders to organize any sort of credible ground defense.

I can't speak for the Marines where "Every Marine a rifleman" has long been their slogan; but I can absolutely say that the Army does not actually qualify EVERY soldier going through Basic Training. The Army comes very close -- every soldier at least fires the service rifle, almost all "qualify" although a few are granted a waiver if they are unable to qualify after several attempts. On the other hand, I have seen several instances of fully "qualified" US Army soldiers making exactly the same mistakes you described. Most soldiers who are not in a combat MOS and not in a Combat unit are likely to see their assigned individual weapon only a few times each year (mostly just cleaning it for inspection) and only fire it one day each year (if that!) Trust me when I say that the typical finance or supply unit would have little more defensive capability than your airmen (or whatever gender-neutral term the Air Force has invented to use).

My point is that simply qualifying with a rifle during initial entry training accomplishes very little, if anything, towards a defensive capability once those personnel arrive at a deployed unit. To create a defensive capability requires more than just weapons qualification (and, yes, you are right that the Army and Marine Corps do cover those topics in initial training) and it also requires continued training in both weapons and tactics for soldiers and leaders on a regular basis throughout their service. Consider how often your security detachment trains on defensive skills; are you really all that confident in the skills of every member of your unit and the people who will be directing you?

Basically the Air Force assumes that they will put air bases in reasonably safe locations or that they will have Army units assigned to protect the air base. So far those assumptions have worked.
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A1C Medrick "Rick" DeVaney
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I Was In The USAF Just Before We No Longer Used Rubber Bands,, But We DID Have To Qualify On The Range... All Of Us....
If One Didn't Qualify, He Had To Keep Returning To The Range & Practicing Until He DID Qualify...... Then We Had To Learn, In Russian, To Say "Put Your Hands DOWN, This Is a FUK Up"...
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SrA Mark Branch
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I totally agree. I was in the AF Security Police back in the early 1980s stationed at Castle AFB, CA (SAC). I was on a 4 man fire team qualified with the M16, M60, and M203. We constantly ran exercises to ensure we could defend all the B52s and other priority weapons. I believe that basic training should train all airmen more with Air Base Ground Defense to be ready to be augmented if needed.
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SGT Michael Wells III
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Don't worry my corporate friend. The Army's got you covered.
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PO1 George White
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Fly your planes, shoot people on the ground, bomb them, and ferry ground fighters to where they need to be, and don't worry about being a gunman yourself. I was in the USN for a career and had training, but under no circumstances was I ever expected to use it unless there was an emergency, and bubba I mean a real emergency. Not much call for an expert rifleman out on the seas bouncing around on ships.
GW
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SSgt Randall Morrow
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IF you remember when you went through BASIC you had to go to the range and shoot an M-16! I was trained, as a part of my job, to be a part of a 44 man mobility team. I don't know if they still to that, BUT I know that all Security Forces personnel still go through "Camp Bullis"! Many forget but we do have a contingency that many Airman are assigned as AUGMENTS to the SF and assist at the gates and other areas to provide support while the MAIN SF personnel can provide the main force of the assault and attract teams when and where needed. Todays' Security Forces (Security Police in my day) have branched out into a larger part of the Security Forces and are trained (in more detail) in the protection of the bases and aircraft.
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Lt Col Michael Hills
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A missing element in the conversation is the incredibly inadequate training of most of the Air Force. When I entered the Air Force in 1986, we touched a weapon exactly once...and that was an m16 modified to fire 22 rounds that jammed every other shot and trained to clear the weapon? No. We raised our hand so range personnel could do it for us. Officer training school in 1995 wasn't much better though we did fire the m9 as well. Add to that only qualifying when deployment is coming and you have your answer. I totally agree most communications types are pretty challenged but it's not on them, proficiency requires training regularly and I recall numerous times in my career when we were given a reduced amount of ammo due to shortages due to budget...you want proficiency, it has a cost.
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