Posted on Feb 7, 2022
As a new section NCO, what would be the best way to deal with squad leaders who skipped the chain of command (myself)?
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Higher ups i.e. my PSG & PL Want to know what will I do
Posted 4 y ago
Responses: 27
I see you are a Corporal, and based on comments you had not updated your rank prior to posting so I will go from there.
You are a Corporal and yes that means you're an NCO. Now while I don't know where you are at in your section, whether you're a Team Leader or a Squad Leader, or in charge of a few Privates and Specialists in your section, etc; how you handle this is going to alter how your troops perceive you.
You said you're a new section NCO, how new? Are your guys just used to going through the other NCO's in the chain? If that's the case you'll have to have a sit down and explain the new chain, but not before you talk with your SGT or SSG as applicable about how that chain functions. No need for you to be putting out false information. I can tell you smart PFC's and SPC's will pick up on that false info quick whether you intended for it to be false or not.
So get with your NCO and work out a plan for who exactly are your Soldiers and how you fit into that structure as a Corporal, then get to know your guys, then start building your leaders book with all of the information you'll need about developing your Soldiers (again, NCO chain for good examples and advice), then have that sit down about the new structure as it applies to you and to them.
If there's issues after that, again, get with your NCO chain about how to conduct your first counseling. As a Corporal you're learning how to become an NCO, hell even as a SGT you're learning all the time, and probably screwing things up along the way. So walk into this knowing you don't know what you're doing all the time and just try to be level headed and learn as much as you're trying to lead.
As a Corporal are you owed respect by virtue of your rank? The quick answer is yes. The real question is, what are you doing to earn that respect? If you come down like a hammer over this probable miscommunication or misunderstanding about where you and they fall in the chain then they might "respect" the rank, but they certainly won't respect you.
You are a Corporal and yes that means you're an NCO. Now while I don't know where you are at in your section, whether you're a Team Leader or a Squad Leader, or in charge of a few Privates and Specialists in your section, etc; how you handle this is going to alter how your troops perceive you.
You said you're a new section NCO, how new? Are your guys just used to going through the other NCO's in the chain? If that's the case you'll have to have a sit down and explain the new chain, but not before you talk with your SGT or SSG as applicable about how that chain functions. No need for you to be putting out false information. I can tell you smart PFC's and SPC's will pick up on that false info quick whether you intended for it to be false or not.
So get with your NCO and work out a plan for who exactly are your Soldiers and how you fit into that structure as a Corporal, then get to know your guys, then start building your leaders book with all of the information you'll need about developing your Soldiers (again, NCO chain for good examples and advice), then have that sit down about the new structure as it applies to you and to them.
If there's issues after that, again, get with your NCO chain about how to conduct your first counseling. As a Corporal you're learning how to become an NCO, hell even as a SGT you're learning all the time, and probably screwing things up along the way. So walk into this knowing you don't know what you're doing all the time and just try to be level headed and learn as much as you're trying to lead.
As a Corporal are you owed respect by virtue of your rank? The quick answer is yes. The real question is, what are you doing to earn that respect? If you come down like a hammer over this probable miscommunication or misunderstanding about where you and they fall in the chain then they might "respect" the rank, but they certainly won't respect you.
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SPC (Join to see)
SFC Kelly Fuerhoff - With a simple click I can be a CSM right now, I'd chalk this up to he didn't update his profile correctly before asking the question. Benefit of the doubt and all.
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SPC Kevin Moon
Regardless his reason he needs to understand that just because they become an nco doesn’t mean that’s the end of the chain of command everyone has someone they answer to regardless of rank. A simple team meeting, sharing something about yourself and admitting hey I’m new to this and asking subordinates for their support and help in your transition to an nco as well as getting to know your soldier ie: pv2 snuffys wife is pregnant and due any day will move mountains in earning their respect. They respect the rank but you have to earn their respect as people i wish you luck in your journey
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SGT Michael Frachiseur
I would have to have a talk with that soldier, if his problem was with me, I still need to know that they are going. They had better have talked with me about the problem first, if it comes back down the chain and they haven't they will feel like their world ended !
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Learning how to effectively utilize your chain of command is fundamental in properly it for its designed purpose. The provides a certain decorum in addressing issues at the appropriate level and fosters communication with a leader who should be addressing the issue at hand.
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We would have a come to Jesus meeting to set.ground rules on how we should conduct our business.
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As a Corporal, you ARE an NCO. Simply instruct your co-worker subordinates that YOU are the start of the chain of command. After that, you address the NCO who allowed them to go around you, but there may be a circumstance where it "could" be proper depending on your unit's SOP and the subject matter, especially if it's of a sensitive or highly personal nature.
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SFC David Reid, M.S, PHR, SHRM-CP, DTM
AMEN - You are an.NCO! Sometimes with new NCO's Thete hearts pump kool-aid.. meaning that sometimes they may lack intestinal fortitude to take charge and correct inappropriate behaviors
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To begin, I wonder what RP does when one is promoted. Does the rank get adjusted? Does the member have a "click" to indicate a higher rank? If not, it's possible to be "stuck" with the rank your rank when you registered. If there is a way to adjust, then, well, that's something else.
If RP does not let you adjust your rank (if so, hey, RP, can y'all so something about that?) then it's possible this person has been promoted. If RP does let you adjust your rank, well, never mind, RP.
So, on to the situation at hand. I would like to answer the question asked, instead of answering some meta-question (this would be a question about a question). First, I recommend being on best terms with your supervisor (the 2nd level to which the squad members are going). Make sure that, if any members of the squad went to that person, then that person talk to you about what the squad member wanted to see the supervisor about. Don't act like it's a bad thing; you just want to be informed. That's all. I recommend that you don't be a block to your supervisor. Next, be as fair as you can with your squad members. Finally, you might want to see what your supervisor feels about it. It could be possible that you and your supervisor could agree on a typical response to squad members in this case: "Have you talked to your Section NCO about this?" If the answer is "No," then your supervisor can then ask, "Why not?" (These are the kind of questions that imply "I think you should go do that, before you come to me" kind of thing).
If RP does not let you adjust your rank (if so, hey, RP, can y'all so something about that?) then it's possible this person has been promoted. If RP does let you adjust your rank, well, never mind, RP.
So, on to the situation at hand. I would like to answer the question asked, instead of answering some meta-question (this would be a question about a question). First, I recommend being on best terms with your supervisor (the 2nd level to which the squad members are going). Make sure that, if any members of the squad went to that person, then that person talk to you about what the squad member wanted to see the supervisor about. Don't act like it's a bad thing; you just want to be informed. That's all. I recommend that you don't be a block to your supervisor. Next, be as fair as you can with your squad members. Finally, you might want to see what your supervisor feels about it. It could be possible that you and your supervisor could agree on a typical response to squad members in this case: "Have you talked to your Section NCO about this?" If the answer is "No," then your supervisor can then ask, "Why not?" (These are the kind of questions that imply "I think you should go do that, before you come to me" kind of thing).
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A1C Medrick "Rick" DeVaney
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SSG Bill McCoy
RP does allow users to correct mistakes, and make changes as may be necessary. It is not automatic. I had to correct a lot of my prior service (Navy) ranks and DOR - no problem.
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Just walk up, knife hand fully extended, and demand they respect your newly appointed authority ... I say this joking of course! LOL.. But seriously if you are new to the role, ask for guidance from your leadership on how to approach this. But above all, have you done initial counseling's will all your guys? As a leader, you should get in the habit of doing initials when you get a new Joe or you move to a new leadership role; even when it is lateral and you stay in the same platoon. This will allow you to talk directly to each one of your Joe's an explain your expectations as a NCO/Leader and allow them to ask you questions about things like "how do you want me to communicate when I have a need..." Leadership is not about "you vs. them" it is about producing results while increasing the abilities of the ones you lead. Yes, at the end of the day you are in charge... but you want them to "want" to follow you, not just have to. Hope that helps, bets of luck!
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MSG (Join to see)
Dude.....I would LOVE to watch him walk up and knife hand a SSG. That's beer and lawn chair level watching right there
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I am confused. The next echelon below platoon is EITHER squad or section. So how are you a section leader with squad leaders below you? Or are the section leaders above you and skipping you by going straight to your Soldiers? Which is their prerogative. It is inadvisable, and leads to confusion and a breakdown in good order and discipline. But sometimes it is necessary, especially in situations which are either time sensitive or a leader wants to address things directly due to the particular gravity of the situation.
Without more details and just a vague complaint, it is very difficult to properly advise.
Was this a one time thing? Is it constant? Have you spoken with the squad leader(s)? Was this an on-the-spot correction or more in the line of tasking or long term guidance? Did the squad leader initially go through you and end up skipping you because whatever it was wasn't getting done - or wasn't getting done RIGHT? Were you present? Were you available? Was this something that could have waited? We're there safety concerns?
So many possibilities of where this would be perfectly legitimate. So many possibilities where it would be bad form.
Without more details and just a vague complaint, it is very difficult to properly advise.
Was this a one time thing? Is it constant? Have you spoken with the squad leader(s)? Was this an on-the-spot correction or more in the line of tasking or long term guidance? Did the squad leader initially go through you and end up skipping you because whatever it was wasn't getting done - or wasn't getting done RIGHT? Were you present? Were you available? Was this something that could have waited? We're there safety concerns?
So many possibilities of where this would be perfectly legitimate. So many possibilities where it would be bad form.
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1SG Alan Boggs
A section is a heavy squad, normally sections are specialized troops such as engineers, artillery and maintenance.
Normally a section sergeant is an E6 who directs the activities of the section. Usually the section sergeant reports to the commander unless there is a warrant officer or a 2nd LT over the section.
SFC O'Malley raised the pertinent questions that would allow someone tongive you accurate advise
Normally a section sergeant is an E6 who directs the activities of the section. Usually the section sergeant reports to the commander unless there is a warrant officer or a 2nd LT over the section.
SFC O'Malley raised the pertinent questions that would allow someone tongive you accurate advise
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Don’t be that guy or you will never be a leader. Also, I don’t care if you are in the position, you aren’t an NCO and should not refer to yourself as one.
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SGT Charles Bartell
SSG (Join to see) - So the army systems had me listed as being Victor qualified. Wrong I was working a 6th Rtb. Ranger Traing Battalion , With Instructor's identifier. That did not make me a R.I. . As a SSGyou should know things are not always up to date, And as a Intell guy you really should know that E-4 can be a Specialist or a Corporal. Do you have access to his curent 201 file ? Or know any one in his leadership? Never assume that the want you see online is a fact.
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SSG (Join to see)
When the army announced that all promotable SPC’s with BLC will be promoted to CPL, the also affected the GAL. If he was pinned CPL, it would update in GALSGT Charles Bartell
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MSG Thomas Currie
SSG (Join to see) -- Your first sentence was good advice -- you should take that advice.
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SSG Bill McCoy
So, the Army has him listed as a SPC. He says he's a CPL so perhaps the paperwork hasn't gone through, or does the Army (of today) use "Acting" CPL's like in my day with "Acting" SGT's? Or, he has perhaps been told he will be made a CPL and his question is based on ANTICIPATION of that. Either way, it deserves a straight answer.
A CPL of course, IS an NCO but the low end of that totem pole. As someone else cautioned him, he also has to PROVE himself a leader, not a mere boss (or words to that affect). Thinking about it since my original reply to him, I would add that he should sit down with his team/section and explain that he's in a unique position ... AND can HELP them with a problem, request or complaint by being a voice for them (as long as he concurs, and finds out all the facts). Also as SPC (Join to see) stated, "get with your NCO and work out a plan for who exactly are your Soldiers and how you fit into that structure as a Corporal." Sound advice.
A CPL of course, IS an NCO but the low end of that totem pole. As someone else cautioned him, he also has to PROVE himself a leader, not a mere boss (or words to that affect). Thinking about it since my original reply to him, I would add that he should sit down with his team/section and explain that he's in a unique position ... AND can HELP them with a problem, request or complaint by being a voice for them (as long as he concurs, and finds out all the facts). Also as SPC (Join to see) stated, "get with your NCO and work out a plan for who exactly are your Soldiers and how you fit into that structure as a Corporal." Sound advice.
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I will answer your question directly. There are some elements, and I will take them one at a time.
First, get with your supervisor. If personnel are skipping the Chain of Command, then they are going to somebody; that is likely to be your supervisor. So get with that person. Discuss what that person has heard/been told.
Next, formulate (draft) a plan to deal with what you heard from your supervisor (yes, you can get your supervisor to provide some guidance, even after you have drafted your plan).
Finally, put your plan into action.
Rinse, repeat. This will be an iterative process. Everyone does it, even your supervisor (very likely).
First, get with your supervisor. If personnel are skipping the Chain of Command, then they are going to somebody; that is likely to be your supervisor. So get with that person. Discuss what that person has heard/been told.
Next, formulate (draft) a plan to deal with what you heard from your supervisor (yes, you can get your supervisor to provide some guidance, even after you have drafted your plan).
Finally, put your plan into action.
Rinse, repeat. This will be an iterative process. Everyone does it, even your supervisor (very likely).
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