Posted on Feb 20, 2018
SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
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Does general military authority allow a Specialist to require a Private to stand at parade rest for them? There was a previous thread discussing whether a Private should automatically stand at parade rest for a Specialist, but I've seen Specialists over the years tell Privates to stand at parade rest when talking to them. Can Specialists do this? It seems like an abuse of general military authority to me.
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SFC Platoon Sergeant
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I would check out TC 3-21.5 specifically the Rest Positions at the Halt. Parade Rest Note:
“Enlisted Soldiers assume this position when addressing all noncommissioned officers or when noncommissioned officers address noncommissioned officers of superior rank.” Seems pretty clear to me. SPC is NOT an NCO and is therefore not due this courtesy.
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SFC(P) Drill Sergeant
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>1 y
CW3 Kevin Storm - With respect in this instance, the individual should be laterally appointed to CPL as I was. The respect indeed should be given however, shouldn't be warranted or required based on what we think.
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CW3 Kevin Storm
CW3 Kevin Storm
>1 y
Should be, but the rank of Corporal has been so poorly managed for the last 35 years it is not used the way it should be.
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SGT Supply Sergeant (S4)
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>1 y
Agreed, however I do believe that the whole ‘position over rank’ thing has to come into play at some point. If the PSG deems that soldier worthy and capable of an NCO position, then absolutely. Then the argument could be made to remove all questions by throwing CPL stripes on that TL until they get promoted, right?
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CWO2 Shelby DuBois
CWO2 Shelby DuBois
>1 y
How about just show professionalism and act accordingly? I'm guessing that since you are surrounded by NCO's, SNCO's, jr Officers and senior OIC's that you just don't like the answers you've been given, so you seek someone out on social media who'll be sympathetic. My first recommendation would be follow the order you were given. If you are so put off and feel belittled by an act of respect, then there is a chain of command ...use it. If you're right, you'll be vindicated and offending SPC will be corrected.
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SPC Shea Parmenter
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When I was a private I was required to stand at parade rest for anyone who outranked me. This was also when we would take our differences to the woodline rather than the counseling packet.
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SPC John Parmenter
SPC John Parmenter
8 y
During my AD time (1961-1964) Specialist 4 was considered an "overpaid private." That was my rank for about two years -- six months of which I held a Sergeant E-5 position, (AT squad leader) with NCO authority & even attended NCO Academy.
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SPC Jeff Colson
SPC Jeff Colson
>1 y
I never passed SPC but I did hold NCO positions. I never made them stand at parade rest for me unless I had to, aka they were screwing around while given a block of instruction or they were being smoked for whatever reason. The only reason I was put in that position was 1. I was fastest gunner on the mortar and 2. All the guys I was over never had a deployment (I had a 15month deployment with my previous unit). They wanted guys who had been there in charge because we had already been in that situation. I wanted the guys to do stuff for me willingly more than forced, anyone one of them could've got better than me and been over me at any given time, no sense in making them hate me.
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SPC Don Wynn
SPC Don Wynn
>1 y
SPC Jeff Colson - Also gunner! Fastest big deflection? I was on the 81mm, did some in 6 seconds, no AG moving the bipod! I had the same because of that, never put anyone on parade rest tho.
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CSM Darieus ZaGara
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You have no military authority below CPl. SGt. unless given so by th unit commander. You have to be acting in the capacity as a supervisor. Often units give that authority by virtue of the commander I general terms. In either case do not assume, verify with the 1SG. Thank you for your service.
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Sgt Charles Welling
Sgt Charles Welling
>1 y
No authority below Cpl? Interesting...…….. so if all leaders E4 and above are killed and all that remain are E3s and below, can they go home? Seems to me the Army has far too many regulations and no common military sense.
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CSM Darieus ZaGara
CSM Darieus ZaGara
>1 y
Not necessarily so. There are provisions in times of conflict. There are standing orders in each organization related to the succession of command.
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Sgt Charles Welling
Sgt Charles Welling
>1 y
Yep, there are provisions in the Marines for peace time and conflict also, if the guy is a higher rank than you are he has authority over you. If you are an NCO (E-4) you don't get shit details like mess duty, I was served chow by an Army E-7 aboard a troop ship, never happen in the Corps. We have some E-3 squad leaders...…….
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CSM Darieus ZaGara
CSM Darieus ZaGara
>1 y
Understood. The only time I have ever seen a Senior NCO serve chow was because he volunteered. We (the Army) do not typically have Squad leaders below E5. We do have Corporals who serve as Squad and Section Sergeants. Take care.
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Can a Specialist make a Private stand at Parade Rest for him?
MAJ Fred Peterman
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I held every rank from E-1 to O-4. When anybody called attention, I put them at ease as soon as possible. I appreciated the respect, but didn't "get off" by making them stand to attention. I think the soldiers or airmen appreciated this. We were there to do the mission, not impress any one.
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SPC Mark Brown
SPC Mark Brown
>1 y
You are, indeed, a rare breed MAJ Fred Peterman Thank you for that insight. While I totally agree and would in all likelihood behave in much the same manner. However, rank has it's due respect as well as the due responsibility that goes with any particular rank or pay grade. I think the is a gentle balance between demanding over the top behavior on the part of a subordinate and being an officer or NCO that can assert authority without slamming a person into the front leaning rest or even "command" parade rest. Thank you, sir for you humble position. I am sure you are a fine officer and an officer who men and women are proud to follow.
Cpl Scott McCarroll COL Mikel J. Burroughs LTC Jeff Shearer
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COL Mikel J. Burroughs
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Edited >1 y ago
Fae33341
SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA When I was private and I was approached by a Specialist military bearing kicked in and I automatically went to Parade Rest and I continued that practice during my entire (9) years of enlisted service when reporting or answering to all those who were above me in rank (as a common courtesy) and even as a commissioned Officer up to including the rank of Full Bird Colonel. Maybe I was brain washed at the early age of 17, but I respected the Army, the Institution, and my immdediate leaders, and the country we served. It was about a higher calling for me. Don't care if there is a regulation or not. It was about soldiering and setting the example for others to emulate. That's my two cents, now I can stand at ease.

CHAPTER 5: MILITARY CUSTOMS & COURTESIES

PARADE REST
Like “Attention”, Parade Rest is a form of respect given to NCOs by those junior in rank. When a Senior NCO enters an area of junior enlisted soldiers or cadets, the room is called to “at ease”. All personnel should immediately go to the position of “stand at-ease” until told to “carry-on”. Likewise, when speaking to an NCO, soldiers junior in rank or cadets, will maintain the position of “parade rest” until instructed to “stand at ease”, “at ease”, or “rest”/relax.

Customs, Courtesies, and Traditions

The Army is an organization that instills pride in its members because of its history, mission, capabilities, and the respect it has earned in the service of the Nation. A reflection of that pride is visible in the customs, courtesies, and traditions the Army holds. Adherence to them connects us with soldiers throughout America's history.

OTHER COURTESIES

4-16. Military courtesy shows respect and reflects self-discipline. Consistent and proper military courtesy is an indicator of unit discipline, as well. Soldiers demonstrate courtesy in the way we address officers or NCOs of superior rank. Some other simple but visible signs of respect and self-discipline are as follows:

When talking to an officer of superior rank, stand at attention until ordered otherwise.
When you are dismissed, or when the officer departs, come to attention and salute.
When speaking to or being addressed a noncommissioned officer of superior rank, stand at parade rest until ordered otherwise.
When an officer of superior rank enters a room, the first soldier to recognize the officer calls personnel in the room to attention but does not salute. A salute indoors is rendered only when reporting.
When an NCO of superior rank enters the room, the first soldier to recognize the NCO calls the room to "At ease."
Walk on the left of an officer or NCO of superior rank.
When entering or exiting a vehicle, the junior ranking soldier is the first to enter, and the senior in rank is the first to exit.
When outdoors and approached by an NCO, you greet the NCO by saying, "Good morning, Sergeant," for example.
The first person who sees an officer enter a dining facility gives the order "At ease," unless a more senior officer is already present. Many units extend this courtesy to senior NCOs, also.
When you hear the command "At ease" in a dining facility, remain seated, silent and continue eating unless directed otherwise.

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SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth
SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth
>1 y
Same thing with me sir, it's engrained in the brain.
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SPC Nancy Greene
SPC Nancy Greene
>1 y
Definitely!
However; most Specialist’s wouldn’t ‘demand’ this formality...they would definitely welcome the show of respect!
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Edited 8 y ago
I would love to see the regulation or policy that requires a Private to stand at parade rest to a Specialist. I'm not aware of one. Maybe there's some unit policy somewhere, but as far as I know there isn't anything in any Army Regulation that requires that. I don't think I ever seen that happen since basic training when the recruits in my platoon was treating the Unit Supply Specialist to that honor.
SP5 Jeannie Carle
SP5 Jeannie Carle
>1 y
Having served 72-79 - I can never once recall ANYone being required to do this to me as a SP4 OR Sp5. (or anyone else) I would have found it strange and unsettling for someone below me in rank to do such a thing.
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SSG Cyber Security Sme And Trainer
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I'm also going to agree with SSG Therrien. By regulation, itis for NCOs. In the units I've been in, Signal Battalion we did not have privates stand at parade rest for SPCs, the MI unit we did not have privates stand at parade rest, and in my infantry unit, they went to parade rest for CPLs, not SPCs. I have seen, and I think it was out of habit, many of the 11Xs still went to parade rest for SPCs. So yeah, I've seen it done by the unit. It is also done if the SPC is in charge (head of a formation, etc) or appointed by someone with the proper authority so they are representing that person in which case parade rest would not be out of line. Require though, would be based on the unit and if their command has said such.
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LTC Stephen F.
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Edited >1 y ago
Interesting question, my friend SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
In my humble opinion only NCOs [and commissioned officer] can direct a soldier of lower rank "to stand at parade rest for them."
The only exception IMHO would be in a training situation in BCT or AIT where a SPC was striped based on duty position and not rank.
In my enlisted experience [1974-1976], only NCOs could direct me to parade rest, attention, or any other position, I was a combat engineer and later a cadet candidate as a PFC. I received a lot of instruction on customs and courtesies. :-)
Thanks for mentioning me COL Mikel J. Burroughs
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SFC Randy Purham
SFC Randy Purham
>1 y
Although not enforced because of the ranking relationship between E1-E4, a Specialist can require a junior ranking soldier to stand at parade rest if they are being addressed. When I was a private, my unit had enforced that as a form of discipline. AR 600-20 covers that and also seek guidance from your unit policies.
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LTC Stephen F.
LTC Stephen F.
>1 y
Interesting and thanks for sharing your experience. SFC Randy Purham I served as an enlisted man in a combat engineer company which included SP5s and SP6s. I was taught only NCOs can issue orders to subordinates.
Later as an infantry officer where PFCs and SP4s were the lowest rank - except for soldiers reduced in rank for offenses. There was a clear rule in the units I served. Only NCOs were authorized to order soldiers. There was a delineated distinction between the specialist ranks and the NCOs ranks.
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SFC Randy Purham
SFC Randy Purham
>1 y
LTC Stephen F., yes absolutely and still there is a delineation between the junior enlisted and NCOs. It boils down to the culture of the unit.
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SSG Lon Watson
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All I can say is go to the Ranger Battalion as a private and tell a “tabbed E-4” you ain’t standing at parade rest....then watch what happens!
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SFC Kenneth G.
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In my first unit, we had a soldier who thought he could just boss anyone who didn't out rank him around. He was about 4 months ahead of me in rank and promotions and time in service. When we would go out downtown and he would get the beer in him, it would start. I out rank you and you have to do what I say. The fight would ensue and he would lose every time. Well it came time and he made Sergeant. When he pinned on his stripes, I told him respectfully that if he still came out with us and started with the I out rank you stuff, he was going to get whipped like a Private because that wasn't how an NCO acted. I also told that to the Detachment Sergeant. Well we went out one night and he decided to go with us. Sure as fire, he started his I out rank you stuff. I asked him twice to stop to no avail. The fight was on and he lost that night so severe they had to pull me off of him. He went to the Detachment Sergeant to bring me up on charges and the Det. Sgt. told him "If you are gong to act like a private I can make you a private". So even as an NCO, you still have to give respect to get respect.
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PO3 Sonar Technician (Surface)
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>1 y
We saw it this way in the Navy too. Used to get people who'd put on their 3rd Class Chevron and get a power trip. Usually the other 3rd's would jump on it and fix the attitude, but occasionally it would require a Chief's intervention.
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