Posted on Jun 17, 2016
I think it's great we are being allowed to roll sleeves again, but we need to do it the way we did BDUs. What do you think?
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Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 108
Is that a tattoo I see?!?!?!?!?!?............The horror!
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Some of us were around when you could roll your sleeves. It doesn't help. You're still hot as Hades in in a sweat shop. The result of rolling your sleeves is a breeze blocking sleeve. A better solution would be to allow soldiers to make the cuff looser in order to encourage a breeze and air to circulate. The rolled sleeve does not help at all. It just looks neat.
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LTC Paul Labrador
Bingo. downrange, I always kept my sleeves loose and cuffs open as possible. It allowed for circulation.
And I find it mildly ironic that a lot of the same folks who are clamoring to roll sleeves to help with heat, are also the same ones who want to return to strached uniforms......which is clogs up the pores of your uniform making it EVEN MORE hot.....
And I find it mildly ironic that a lot of the same folks who are clamoring to roll sleeves to help with heat, are also the same ones who want to return to strached uniforms......which is clogs up the pores of your uniform making it EVEN MORE hot.....
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Everyone else is able to roll their sleeves up - penpocket or not. If you take your tiime and do it correctly, it looks fine. I roll my ACU sleeves up everyday. Its hot out here. I'm not baking if I don't have to. I haven't gotten sunburned or anything. Crazy.
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I would like to see sleeves rolled again, but with the pin pockets on the sleeves that is not possible. I can understand why some leaders are against it as well though. If your sleeves are up you risk sun burn on your arms. At the same time with the sleeves up it is tighter on your arms therefore trapping more body heat. Just my opinion though.
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And this is why I don't have a subscription to Army Times anymore. Until we have a uniform that will support rolling the sleeves up it this question is moot.
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I'm glad to see someone else remembers. One of the major points for the BDU roll is that a tug on the sleeve brings it all of the way down, if you are hit by an irritant
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I've always heard that the only reason the Marines don't do camo out is because they couldn't get the funding required to extend their Boot camp by two weeks for them to learn this method.
Sorry, I couldn't resist!
Sorry, I couldn't resist!
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After having read most all of the opinions here I feel like puking. I never understood the whole "sleeves down all around" thing when it was forced upon us 10(?) years ago - frankly I thought it was stupid and it pissed me off. What bugs me about the naysayers are comments such as "it looks terrible", "our patches are covered up", "it won't make you cooler", "I'll get sunburn" and so on. Back when we wore the pickle suits (pre 1982ish), the guys who had arms as big as most people's thighs were allowed to roll their sleeves up to their elbows - common sense, no big deal. Back to today: The only reason the Army is doing this is because Soldiers asked for it. God only knows how many polls were taken, risk management studies conducted, committees formed, photographs taken and compared, more polls taken, and CSM's threatening to resign if sleeves are allowed up. Soldiers want this (at least, the majority do) so suck it up and drive on people! But what really bites are all the CSMs and 1SGs who are going to screw their troops and not allow sleeves up because they don't like it - I say CSMs and 1SGs because few commanders will buck them on an issue like this.
I get it, this is a forum for people to express their opinions - I just find it disappointing this is such a big, passionate deal to a few, not to mention the senior NCO's and officers promising this will never happen in their unit. I've been in since 1978 and have dealt with every uniform issue since, both good and bad. The worst travesties I remember was when the black beret was taken from the Rangers and the khaki uniform discarded. This is about the OPTION of rolling up sleeves - no one is going to force you to do it either way, unless you have one of those "special" CSMs/1SGs. It's also kind of embarrassing when the other branches of the military read this stuff and wonder out loud "what's up with the Army?" Marvelous.
I get it, this is a forum for people to express their opinions - I just find it disappointing this is such a big, passionate deal to a few, not to mention the senior NCO's and officers promising this will never happen in their unit. I've been in since 1978 and have dealt with every uniform issue since, both good and bad. The worst travesties I remember was when the black beret was taken from the Rangers and the khaki uniform discarded. This is about the OPTION of rolling up sleeves - no one is going to force you to do it either way, unless you have one of those "special" CSMs/1SGs. It's also kind of embarrassing when the other branches of the military read this stuff and wonder out loud "what's up with the Army?" Marvelous.
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In response to your question, absolutely yes. As a side note, I'm less excited by rolled sleeves, and more excited by cuffed sleeves in the field. I've been fighting that fight for almost as long as I've been in the army, so I'll take the small victories as they come. Now, to get the commander on board!
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It's states it clearly that it's at commanders discretion (keep in mind it doesn't say at individual Soldier's discretion) meaning that he/she identifies the need to roll up sleeves then orders the whole unit to roll up the sleeves. UNIFORMITY! I see it more as a way or tool to mitigate for heat. Now we have to worry about applying sun block on the arms cause there are Soldiers like myself that burn under the sun if not applied.
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MSG (Join to see)
Preventive Medicine units are about to give all kinds of safety briefs to commanders
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I just love to hear people responding in categorical terms "It will not help", "It does nothing", especially coming from Officers and Senior Enlisted. Why not pay attention to the Junior Enlisted, the ones that have to put up with countless hours of details and work not just under the sun but also terrible humidity? I personally hated when the Army, in tune with a paternalistic government, took away from me the ability to simply roll up my sleeves, as if countless generations across the globe had been wrong all along. Marines still do, and they are still kicking but!
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I have worn them both ways in the Army!! With the cuff on the out side it is a content having to readjust the cuff, 4 or 5 times a day. It falls down when your working, or when you put the blouse on. When you roll it the [ ARMY way] it looks smart . It looks like you spent time getting the right look. Yes it seems that it`s the Marine way but it was the Army way before BDU`s It`s about the look of a profensanl . Cuff on the outside dose NOT have the LOOK. It only gets the sleeve down in 2 sec. flat.
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I was a captain at Knox in the 70's then somebody invented the sleeve roll. There was some joking about it--quite a lot of fuss about something trivial. It got worse. BG Ulmer at Hood decided it was a waste of time (it wasn't a "policy" yet, just a fad). He was slapped down by the Chief of Staff, and the new method became an instant tradition.
But it really isn't that hard, and it avoids, I guess, the humiliation of having a small area of faded-side fabric exposed.
But it really isn't that hard, and it avoids, I guess, the humiliation of having a small area of faded-side fabric exposed.
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And if that's the case, roll up sleeves because we're not in a hazardous environment in garrison then why not grow facial hair. That is the reason we can't grow facial hair because NBC mask will not seal properly. If we go let's go all out, rolled sleeves and gotees..
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CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
I'm all for it - neatly trimmed beards and mustaches. Chicks dig it on a guy in cammies. If we all can't be operators we can at least look like them.
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I just the Senior NCO complaints about uniformity and utility. Great googly moogly!
Roll up or wear them down, I don't care. But stop the uniformity crap and the ceremony. You didn't have a ceremony for your beloved reflective belt, you don't need one for this.
Roll up or wear them down, I don't care. But stop the uniformity crap and the ceremony. You didn't have a ceremony for your beloved reflective belt, you don't need one for this.
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LTC Trent Klug
1LT Timothy Schlink - We went permanent sleeves down at the 7th ID. We were RDF forces, dont you know.
That was the same time we got a Division CSM, I won't mention his name, who demanded uniformity. All division personnel had to tie down TA-50 with 550 cord, per division SOP. All us infantryman had to remove our butt packs because the drivers couldn't wear theirs while behind the wheel. Everyone had to camouflage up when the war belt got worn. Including at the range. Gotta love the uniformity mongers.
Of course during Operation Just Cause, my Company being C Co, got the remains of a BDU issue. I got XXL Long tops and bottoms. I wore Large Long. I cut 6 inches off the bottoms of the pants and rolled up the sleeves as they extended past my fingertips. Got told to unroll them by the Division CSM. I guess he liked me looking like a clown.
That was the same time we got a Division CSM, I won't mention his name, who demanded uniformity. All division personnel had to tie down TA-50 with 550 cord, per division SOP. All us infantryman had to remove our butt packs because the drivers couldn't wear theirs while behind the wheel. Everyone had to camouflage up when the war belt got worn. Including at the range. Gotta love the uniformity mongers.
Of course during Operation Just Cause, my Company being C Co, got the remains of a BDU issue. I got XXL Long tops and bottoms. I wore Large Long. I cut 6 inches off the bottoms of the pants and rolled up the sleeves as they extended past my fingertips. Got told to unroll them by the Division CSM. I guess he liked me looking like a clown.
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CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret)
"You didn't have a ceremony for your beloved reflective belt, you don't need one for this." LTC Klug, love it!
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I easily lost track of all the uniform changes we went through during my 30 years...needless to say, it was an expensive business having to buy my own uniforms, so had to find a creative solution. Sleeves? The local Commander drives uniform wear and who knows which way that wind was blowing at any one moment. So, what to do? Simple. I took two BDU shirts to a local tailor, had her cut off the sleeve a few inches below the shoulder and nicely cut off the cuff at the end of the sleeve...then sew the cuff back on to that piece that was left a few inches below the shoulder (length measured to ensure it was to regulation). To all purposes and intent, it looked exactly as if I had correctly rolled my sleeves up with the green side showing. OK, Snuffy, you say, and what happened when Sgt. Smoke or Major Muscle came calling with an order to roll down sleeves? Easy, I always kept one other long sleeve BDU close by and quickly changed into the correct shirt. Worked every time for me.
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The method of soldiers with the BDUs not only distinguished us from the Marines, but we set higher standards . ARMY; hooah!
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SGT Johnny Owens
1LT Timothy Schlink - we only rolled them in the rear, we didn't have shorts and t-shirts with BDU/DCUs like the fatigues.
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Some of us are old enough to remember when everyone rolled their !@#@#%% sleeves the same way. The justification for the !@##$%% "Army Way" (which may have stayed rolled up if you worked in an office) was NBC threat; it truly pains me to say that the Marines clearly outsmarted us on this one.
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Was the fabric different in the BDUs than the ACUs? I think that having the cuff on the outside looks better. You're right on the point on regards for fast acting roll-down sleeves, SFC. If you need to quickly acting and roll your sleeves the BDU way, then by all means but if it's for an all-day occasion with permission, having the cuff outside would be best.
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