Posted on Apr 9, 2017
MAJ Telecommunications Systems Engineer
108K
1.39K
385
139
139
0
Bb73918b
Some officers are meant to command and lead, and others probably should never be allowed the opportunity. I'm a witness to the case of an ousted ex-commander now working as a staff-O "leading" a highly technical department - his lack of technical competence and inability to mentor and lead others is obvious. Should such an officer be "encouraged" to separate or retire early to make room?
Posted in these groups: 200210106b CommandGeneral of the army rank insignia OfficerDod color DoD
Avatar feed
Responses: 267
Votes
  • Newest
  • Oldest
  • Votes
Sgt Dale Briggs
0
0
0
Have to say in my short stint in the military the officers were about invisible and they didn’t lead shit. The Sr NCOs ran the units, their word was law and they were there every day, hell you might see your Plt Commander once in a blue moon, really no idea what he did, and Top ran the show. You needed something you went to Top or you went to the Gunny, most officers just stayed away.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
1SG Leroy Lucero
0
0
0
They should be retss as ined and given another chance if they meet certain criteria.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SFC Melvin Brandenburg
0
0
0
I think there is a place for every skill set except for those who lack integrity.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
LTC David Howard
0
0
0
Being relieved of command was once a common tool used in the military to quickly replace a non effective leader. It was not career ending, and because of that, was used often and effectively. Some of our most famous and capable military leaders, such as U.S. Grant, had been relieved of command at one time or another. In more current times, the action of relief was the "kiss of death" for an officer, and therefore superiors were hesitant to use that tool except for the most egregious incompetence. But being relieved of command does not mean that the individual was a total failure as an officer, only that he failed in that particular situation. Failure may not be due to technical incompetence, or inability to lead. Some like Gen. George McClellan, was loved and admired by the troops, was credited with enormous skill in the assembling, training and equipping of the larges army ever put together to that time in the country, but whose hesitancy to attack the enemy due to his constant over estimation of enemy strength finally led to President Lincoln relieving him. And this ended up happening more than once. Up until and including WWII, commanders were relieved when just not getting the job done, but often contributed in other ways, or even in command again, to help us win the war.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
LTJG Richard Bruce
0
0
0
I realized by career was over when I didn't get a second at-sea billet. Too many JO's and not enough jobs. My ship's Captain didn't get the HQ assignment he wanted. Needed it to be considered for Admiral. The Up-or-Out system does not allow stagnation. Staff jobs are not designed to have officers homestead, but to allow senior officers to evaluate command potential. There are openings for specialists in a civilian role. I'm waiting to hear about a civilian intel I applied for last week.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
TSgt Robert A Nichols
0
0
0
I said that the reason that caused the being relieved, must be look into first. Having saying that, no that person has showed can’t be trusted to handle the power that come with command.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGT Lenise Hamilton
0
0
0
Depending upon the circumstances, If lives were lost unecessarly, they should be (CM) Court Martialed and booted out ASAP. If they are just incompetent/total Rag-Bag, nine times out of ten, they are thrown somewhere in a dusty desk drawer and always given another assignment else-where.. As the saying goes out-of sight/out-of mine.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
1SG Michael Farrell
0
0
0
The bad part of those riffs was that a lot of great soldiers were screwed. On the other hand, a lot of those former officers were placed in their old ranks or in Warrant officer positions. Lots of great soldiers stayed on active duty and were great mentors for the rest of us.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
1SG Michael Farrell
0
0
0
My first 1SG assignment let me experience the sort of hell that John Wayne and Ward Bond played in Fort Apache...except my CO lied, was paranoid, deranged and possibly sociopathic. Screwed me over with a miserable SEER, but it made it possible for me to taking my diamonds back every chance I got. Realizing that I'd been screwed over, a couple of CSMs got to let me see one of the senior raters comments. "Do not assign this officer to lead soldiers again." He was SERBED, and landed a position in HS ROTC. And, given our branch specificity, heard he was and still be an effective ROTC trainer...

So, I learned a few things that were really tough love. One thing was that if you focused on the problem in the relief documents and evaluations, and take the time to do it right, the Army will listen. And Karma is not so much a bitch as it is and can be a resolution.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
1SG Robert Rush
0
0
0
I have had a few soldiers promoted to the rank of SGT, E-5 because of their performance. After a period of time, they could not preform in a leadership position. I monitored each individual's chain of command, Squad Leader and Platoon Sergeant to insure he was getting good leadership training for the position he was in. When it can apparent to his chain and myself that he was not ready to be a leader, I would ask him to voluntary step back because he was not ready for that position. I did not pressure the individual, we talked and he would give up that position and rank. I never had to take his rank. As far as what you are talking about, hare the Army Regulations!
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Capt John Schmitt
0
0
0
Two separate issues to me. Technical competence is likely not needed to head up and lead the unit. A basic understanding, definitely.
Leadership to counsel and mentor those in his-her unit, absolute requirement.
Also, being previously relieved of command would depend on circumstances. May not have significance in different billet, particularly a purely staff function.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSG(P) Danielle Birtha
0
0
0
The Military has a way of dealing with that... Performance Review should address his shortcomings.
If he is not capable, he shouldn't be leading anyone.
If it's that bad, he should be denied re-enlistment.
Too many lives depend on leaders doing the right thing...
Why allow him to continue to lead?
Government Issue that is defective should be replaced ;)
my opinion
caveat: I served under two who should not have been commissioned, imo...
One was delusional and would have gotten our entire unit slaughtered if we went into combat (gung ho busted Pathfinder who was certain an air traffic control unit should be Ranger qualified)... the other was fraternizing on and off duty with his E-4 aide.
Both are probably still serving.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CMDCM Steve Ketchum
0
0
0
It depends upon why the officer was relieved. Having said that, officers have a senior enlisted who should be keeping them on the right path along with a senior officer who should be giving guidance and corrective steps. If an officer or senior enlisted leader fails it's usually because they entered an environment that they weren't qualified to be in but there are always those who always think they know better than everyone else and soon find themselves on a raft in the middle of the pond without a paddle.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Lt Col Leo Shockley
0
0
0
I’ve seen top leaders being “fired” because of mistakes of those under them. If eligible, they may have to retire or else be moved somewhere else, not everyone is a leader but remember, if those under the leaders do not do those best, the leaders may pay the price,
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSG J F Texas
0
0
0
They will run an enlisted member out of the service so the same standard should start within the officer corps too. Incompetence, lack of leadership ability or just a dirt bag, officers need to police their ranks instead of just shuffling their undesirables out of sight.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Lt Col Bill Fletcher
0
0
0
There is no blanket correct answer. Why was the officer relieved is the start point. Was it it for his bad acts? If so then that officer should be released. If it was for other factors then it depends what they are. Was the officer promoted to a position he could not handle, but he was a good staff officer? If so return to staff position and allow him to continue until retirement. We all know his promotion opportunities have ended, but he may still provide a benefit to the service.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
Lt Col Bill Fletcher
0
0
0
There is no blanket correct answer. Why was the officer relieved of command? His personal bad acts, then no, he should be encouraged to retire. Perhaps he was a better staff officer( who was promoted to a job above his ability) who could actually provide benefit to the Service by returning to a Staff position. Is that officer going to go much further, probably not, but no reason to waste his ability by an early release.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SPC Joe Greco
0
0
0
No they should not command well my time in the military in the 70s we had so many command his sergeant majors that were alcoholics and they were no good
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSgt Fuels
0
0
0
Unfortunately, it happens all the time just to allow scumbags to make it to retirement. Billets created, etc., just to give them a place to quietly hide until they can squeak out to save face for a commander/unit/whatever.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SPC Human Resources Specialist
0
0
0
I've seen plenty of awesome leaders at the platoon and company levels that completely bombed at the higher levels. Especially as they moved farther away from regular interactions with the junior enlisted. They lost that connection with the foundation of their command as the administrative portion of their duties overrode those times to connect.
(0)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small

Join nearly 2 million former and current members of the US military, just like you.