Why does the Army appear to have a discipline issue with the lower enlisted ranks?

The lack of discipline is rampant, across our society, along with a lack of respect. We have corrupted everything in life and thrown away guiding principles... Religion, morals and ethics. Our children don't say the pledge of allegiance in schools, Religion is frowned upon and in decline...even our founding documents are looked at as archaic pieces of paper which are supposed to be considered changeable. America is on the decline like the many great states of the past, such as Rome before her. Soon it will be but a memory and what replaces it will only be created by death and bloodshed...Only then will people realize that they squandered and killed a perfect union. Perhaps they will finally learn what our history teachers once taught us..."Those who fail to learn from the past are doomed to repeat history.!"

I would say it is because the Government getting involved with the way we run the Army, which is the way we were taught by the ones before us and the ones before them and so on.

My personal opinion is based on my 34 years in the Army (both enlisted time and officer). I came in when the Army was transitioning to the all volunteer Army. During my years I have seen a reduction in respect for NCOs and officers. The Army is catering to the Generational wants of new recruits (both enlisted and officer), this is especially true in the last couple of years, with the new (still not official) PT test and the reins being pulled back on Drill Sgts. When I was in basic training (1977), the main goal was to turn civilians into future soldiers, by pushing the trainees to the limit mentally and physically. The outcome of Basic was having a trainee, who understood the chain of command and was ready for training in their MOS. This is not the case today.

Look at the questions that get posted on here. Young enlisted personal complaining about their rights being abused, making us work Saturday, inspecting my room, telling me how I can dress to travel, the list goes on and on. I don't want to be that cranky old dude, but I mean when I signed the contract, I felt I gave up my free will for the term, today, the kids demand their rights to everything. Don't curse at my boy drill instructor, you might hurt his feelings. Or going from don't ask don't tell, to the military should pay for my sex change. My room mate was gay in 76, we all knew it, we didn't care. He did his job. Now not all units might have been that way, but it was my experience. He was not the first one, nor the first one known, and would not be the last. But now, I am sure you would be concerned about how you talked to a gay soldier, because you could end up having charges brought. Its a different world I guess.

I believe its more of a brotherhood thing and comroderie thing. When i was lower enlisted i showed my respect in situations that called for it but as a whole we were all brothers in arms and that was more of a show than anything. When i was deployed for operation uphold democracy in Haiti im not sure i ever said yes sargeant or anything of that nature. We were more worried about getting shot by aks at that point. I ultimately ended my tour there for last 90 days driving colnels and higher many times driving certain generals and i hope I maintained my discipline with rank then but when bullets were flying i can promise you i didnt say sir or ma’am. Just a though situation dictates alot

I believe that the discipline problems in the Army (and all the military services) is a generational one. When I started on Active Duty in the post Vietnam volunteer Army, there were all kinds of problems with discipline, alcohol, drugs etc. I kept very busy as an MP in Germany dragging wayward soldiers to the station or in some cases they went directly to their 1SG. Continuing my service in the Guard, things vastly improved in the 80's and 90's. Discipline suffered again about 3-5 years after 9/11 as the Army lowered standards for enlistment because of the need for manpower. Waivers for law violations, drug use and taking in non HS graduates. As you reap so shall you sow. The recent generations of recruits also come in with an entitlement mentality. The "everyone gets a trophy" mentality. It's not across the board. I agree with the SFC who commented that the more hard charging units like Airborne, Cav, Rangers and outfits such as the USMC have more dedicated soldiers thus less disciplinary problems compared to the general soldier. I've glossed over several topics but you could easily write a book about this issue. Many more factors are at play here involving our society as a whole. Good luck. Hope I've given you some food for thought.

CPT Wilford, I am willing to bet that neither post was Fort Bragg. I visited Bragg once - stopped a very senior SP4 (I was an E-5 SGT),to ask a question, he went to parade rest, shouted his unit motto and answered my request. I was one of those Army linguist made E-5 in 2 years (and stayed E-5 until I got out 6 years later). Different posts, different commands and different focus on Military Courtesy and discipline.

This raises the question, is this lack of discipline and increase in discipline issues reflect the society as a whole? I am curious if this problem is common with other civilizations as they declined. It would be very interesting to see if there are any original accounts from the Roman legions, the Spartans, or other legendary fighting forces documenting a similar issues as the society declined.

I'd love to read the paper when you're done with it. Would you consider posting it here?

Having been Navy and a tour with an Amphibious (FMFPAC), they are numerically smaller than an Army unit. When on a small “warship”... you can fall over. (You don’t piss off people). Having commanded Two Army Basic Training commands and Infantry .... the size of the Army is huge. Go from a Navy/Marine command of hundreds to a Light Division of well over 10,000 and discipline can be a problem... I have personally walked men through their separations and reduced an E-6 to E-3. Also, the lower ranks tend to be just out of High School, and are initiated to alcohol.

Thank you for being honest and admit that we are one fighting force. Personally, I was a smart a__ , and had a Senior Chief and a Gunnery Sergeant “Counsel” me (in a dark passageway). Historically, the Navy and Marines fight each other... but will come together when it matters.... which will be joined by the Army too. Pride runs deep in all branches.

JO3, Buck Sgt., Captain, IN