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Command Post What is this?
Posted on Jul 19, 2018
SSG Gerhard S.
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1SG Police Lieutenant
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I don't believe we should. As a 30 yr veteran I feel like the Military is something that you have to feel! If you force the unwilling to enter service, their heart won't be in it, and it could get good soldiers killed. Let the little whining draft dodgers stay at home with their parents, while the real patriots protect them and their freedoms!!

MSG R Gates (Ret)
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SSG Gerhard S.
SSG Gerhard S.
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Well argued!
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SFC Albert Green
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SFC Albert A. Green. I often see someone my age and he will not make eye contact or look the other way, I ware my V N. Hat most of the time. I wonder how he lives with what he did and what does he say to his grandkids when they ask why he wasn’t in the war.
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PO1 Kevin Dougherty
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I don't agree with your basic premise. But I respect that it is a thought out one.
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SFC Jeff Duncan
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I had the great fortune to run into Jane Fonda in a upscale club in Atlanta when she was married to Ted Turner. I had had one to many teqkillyou shots that a friend was buying copious amounts of. My father was Special Forces in Vietnam and I remember meeting my dad for the first time when he left Vietnam after second tour in Naples Italy. They kept him there for 3 years while he became civilized again. I remember listening to he and my mother “ who also was career Army” talk about Fonda and Kerry, so when I had her in my sights and very limited control of expressing my feelings I let her have it with both barrels and she had no doubt of my disgust and disdain for her. I felt my pop’s laughing from on high. I had a mixed audience in the club, I feel I got more claps then boo’s.
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SSG Edward Tilton
SSG Edward Tilton
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The only time I got worked up about Jane Fonda was BARBARELLA.
I wasn’t interested in her mind
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MSG Izy Veguillacruz
MSG Izy Veguillacruz
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I love Jane Fonda Urinal stickers
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SSG Edward Tilton
SSG Edward Tilton
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Had to drag Jane Fonda into it. Who cares.
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Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
>1 y
Jane...who?
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SSG Michael Doolittle
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I think you stated it very well.... Trump had a Doctor state a lie on his behalf, a statement that for all intents and purposes is "Under Penalty of Perjury"....
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SSG Michael Doolittle
SSG Michael Doolittle
>1 y
Trump went on after this letter to play sports, what more proof do you need, as for Clinton / Cheney et al they all used Educational Deferments, G.W Bush used his father to get him an "Unavailable" slot in the Texas Air Guard.... I agree with you about the draft, and the only one I respect for their decision was Ali, who lost his title and Millions of $$$$$ and served time in prison, but kept his honor and integrity
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SSG Gerhard S.
SSG Gerhard S.
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SSG Michael Doolittle - For the record, I agree with you about Muhammad Ali, though I would point this out... "In 1967, Ali was convicted of draft evasion, sentenced to five years in prison and fined $10,000. However, he remained free while he appealed his case. The Supreme Court in 1971 unanimously overturned Ali’s conviction."
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SPC John Tacetta
SPC John Tacetta
>1 y
SSG Gerhard S. - Ali was sidelined that entire time which is a long period in the professional life of a boxer and he could not make money in the ring during that time. That probably would have been the end of a lesser man.
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Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
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It's been pointed out that, at the time of his deferments, Trump was a Democrat.

Interesting...
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PO2 Lawrence Janiec
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The draft is something that the leaders of our country decided that was needed for the betterment of our country. Sort of like the orders for people to stay in their homes right now. If someone thought they were above those laws/policies (because they had money), then why should they be the ones to make the new laws or policies? It's an ethical issue at its core. Do you really want those who think they are too good to follow policies to make them?

Also, when one of the first elementary school shootings happened in 2017, POTUS said that if he were there he would "charge right in" to defend those children. (Paraphrasing, don't recall the actual quote) and then the first snippy answer given was, Well, if your legs are bad and you couldn't serve in the military, then how would your bad legs allow you to "charge right in"? The other snippy answer I had was, Sure he'd charge in, because he'd have a dozen or so Secret Service Agents armed to the teeth with him to protect him.....

I also find it sort of amusing that our current POTUS, who idolized Hitler, has his own SS.... (There was an article in Vanity Fair from the 90s about how he did, if you don't believe me, Google it. I was shocked when I first read it.)
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CPT William Jones
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I believe a lot like the preceding person. If an individuals leaves before he is called I don’t like it but they have broken no law and it is their right to emmigrate. If they receive notice and leave that is criminal and they should have to spend jail time. What trump did was follow the law. Don’t like people like that but it is not illegal. FYI I did send over 6 years in service including 32 months in Vietnam as a combat engineer and advisor to ARVN.
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SSG Gerhard S.
SSG Gerhard S.
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Thank you for sharing your thoughts, comments, and experiences.
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SPC Cathy Evans
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Just a thought: Slaves were neither paid nor given benefits; however, I do believe soldiers were both paid and provided benefits.
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SPC Michael Tierney
SPC Michael Tierney
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In 1967, I believe my pay was about $69/month. The benefits when I was discharged a couple years later were great. I never felt I was being subjected to anything close to slavery.
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MAJ Hugh Blanchard
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I remember the case of Mohammad Ali, formerly known as Cassius Clay, who was an astonishing athlete and Olympic Gold Medal winner as a boxer. He refused to be drafted, and accepted his legal punishment and went to prison. I entirely disagreed with his position, but I entirely respected his courage to accept punishment and do his time in prison.
I do NOT agree that a draft is involuntary servitude. If you are a citizen of the United States, you must defend the republic that defends you. If your country tells you they require your services for the survival of the nation, then you must serve your nation or face the consequences. If you disagree with your nation's policies, then file a lawsuit after you report to duty. But don't ask others to defend your nation while you live in safety, based on the efforts of better men and women.
My father taught me not to depend on the efforts of others, but to make my own way n the world. We haven't taken welfare, and we haven't run away from danger. I'm the 7th generation of my family to serve in the Army, in the Revolutonary War, on both sides of the Civil War, in both World Wars, Korea, Vietnam and the Cold War. Garry Owen!
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SPC John Tacetta
SPC John Tacetta
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SSG Gerhard S. - Gerhard, you seem unable or unwilling to appreciate that just as you are guaranteed to "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Freedom" you are also obligated to to answer the call. That's the Constitution speaking, not me. If you want to call it servitude, who am I to argue, it is called the service after all.

I concede your point: being drafted is servitude and your freedoms are restricted during your service. You need to "man up" and accept that that's a condition of your citizenship. Too often we forget that freedom has a price. This is part of that price. One of the conditions of being a citizen of this country is that you may be impressed for a period of 6 to 8 years, like it or not. You can pay that price or another, you still retain that freedom.

Call it what you will, service is not slavery, at least not as it was practiced in this country. You are not chattel and neither you or your children may be sold to another. Your suggestion otherwise belittles the torment that the slaves that helped build this country endured.
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SSG Gerhard S.
SSG Gerhard S.
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SPC John Tacetta - Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this matter. I'm curious though, since you state "That's the Constitution speaking...", if you could quote the clause in the Constitution that indicates "One of the conditions of being a citizen of this country is that you may be impressed for a period of 6 to 8 years, like it or not. "
Secondly, though our politicians DID take us to war in Vietnam, and in other places, one could reasonably argue that doing so did nothing to guarantee our freedoms here in the US. The results speak for themselves. After our men and women sacrificed, or were sacrificed, after wasting our blood, and treasure in places like Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan for a generation (well after Al Qaeda was destroyed), what greater freedoms do we have to show for it? Vietnam was left to the Socialists, Afghanistan is returning to the Taliban, and Iraq is left weaker, more divided, and more violent than it was before we arrived.
As I suggested, if our freedoms are at risk, one suspects there will be no shortage of volunteers to defend our freedoms from interlopers, at least of the foreign variety. To suggest our involvement in many of our conflicts made the US any more free, fails to align with the reality or the results.

Thank you for your thoughtful and respectful reply.
Respectful Regards.
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Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis
>1 y
There once was a fighter named Clay
He could rhyme anything he could say.
But is career, it is sad, went overlong by a tad.
In the end, he couldn't rhyme.
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MAJ Hugh Blanchard
MAJ Hugh Blanchard
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I still admire Cassius Clay, later known as Muhammed Ali. Thank you to SSG Seidel for enlightening me on the particulars of the case. I think that his willingness to go to jail rather than submit to something with which he disagreed is the primary reason for my regard towards Muhammed Ali. I don't hold the same regard for those who disagreed with the draft and then fled to another country or went 'underground' to avoid military service. I don't believe that the constitutionality of the Selective Service Act has been tested before the Supreme Court. I do believe that the maintenance of a free society requires that we citizens defend the country. Until the Supremes rule against Selective Service, I believe that a citizen must submit to the draft when the nation calls him or her to service.
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PFC Tom O'Day
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Thank you for raising an intelligent issue. I do not now and did not as a young man consider the Draft to be any kind of unjust form of servitude. I confess to be from another era, my active duty enlistment in the Marines ended in July 1958. Just 13 years after my father's WW2 enlistment ended and I have brother between us whose term in Korea was also Volunteer.
It is almost a rite of passage in my family. War after foolish war. Generation after generation. Why?
You answered that early. We live in a country until recently envied by people all over the planet, the land of the free and home of the brave. My father often stated that there were many heroes, the overwhelming majority were never noticed or ribboned. Only a few lived to be recognized.
I like that bumper sticker that says "Freedom Isn't Free". I like every other VET on this website swore an oath to defend the USA and it's CONSTITUTION against ALL ENEMIES foreign and domestic(other Americans). In the service that meant even with your life. To ensure all those great things we enjoy as Americans. Consider it paying dues to the most magnificent club on earth. By your service drafted or volunteer, the uniform is the same. The job to protect our families right to all those benefits into the future.
As for Trump he is in my mind a Traitor. The doctor who falcified his bone spur issued admitted it, his practices offices were in a Trump building, Sr. Trump indicated he might have to move out. Trumps Gfather fled Austria to avoid the draft. Austo-Hungarian War, was refused return when he tried to go home. Father never served. What this fellow has been doing his whole life has been criminal. Some envy him, others jealous none are Patriots in my mind. Patriots don't an indivual who makes sport of the Constitution, threatens people doing their sworn duty, makes fun of the parents of the fallen. The oath we took didn't have an expiration date, that will be noted on my headstone.

Thanks for the opportunity Tom ("Mike") O'Day
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SPC Michael Tierney
SPC Michael Tierney
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I wouldn't call Don a traitor, just a draft dodger.
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SPC John Tacetta
SPC John Tacetta
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SPC Michael Tierney - Not then. Now? Russia, China. I suppose not even now, but he is a loose cannon for sure.
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SSG Edward Tilton
SSG Edward Tilton
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On the one hand he should have served, on the other, not in my fox hole. He would be complaining and talking about himself until I left him for the enemy.
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