Failure
Failure
Posted on Feb 17, 2020
During the draft period, what happened to conscripted members who could not make it past the initial training?
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In an all-volunteer military, there are a certain amount of recruits who just do not make it through basic or the job-specific (AFSC, MOS, whatever the Navy and USMC calls it) training. They are discharged for failure to adapt or to meet standards.
What would have happened to these conscripted members who were unable to meet the minimal standards? Were they just pushed through the system after the training was "presented" to them without having to prove they could actually do the job? Would they have been honorably discharged?
What would have happened to these conscripted members who were unable to meet the minimal standards? Were they just pushed through the system after the training was "presented" to them without having to prove they could actually do the job? Would they have been honorably discharged?
Selective Service (the Draft)
Failure
Training
Discharge
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 19
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First thing is that the classification system was designed to weed out those that couldn't perform because of obvious physical or mental conditions, the designation 4F was for those deemed unfit. If you actually made it to the painted feet, the standards were completely different. From my observation of the remains of the Draft Army when I came in and anecdotally from those that served during the period, there just weren't many standards for the draftees. Couldn't pass PT? You will get in shape in Vietnam. Overweight? Not a problem. A marine friend that is a bit older than I am that served in Marine Infantry claimed that half of his platoon wouldn't have passed the IQ test required today (1966/67 time frame). While I am of the opinion that we put out people that with a bit of motivation would be acceptable soldiers today, the reason for the standards we have today was the Cluster**** that the Vietnam Draft made of the services.
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SSG Frank Bova
Just look up McNamara's Project 100,000, or more commonly called The McNamara 100,000 plan. I was DS and got a half platoon of these guys and it was a disaster from beginning to end.
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I served 1965/68 enlisted but with many drafted men during that period,everyone made it through training ,if not the Army had recycling programs which had a small number of personnel fail,these men were returned to civilian life with a general discharge I think,also had experiences with Pres.Johnson’s 100,000 program in Vietnam ,replacements for Infantry units,piss poor decision by the bean counters in my estimation.
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SGT Philip Roncari
SP5 Bernard Chandler
I’m never off the subject of that “Mattie Mattel “ piece of junk we were issued back in 1966 on our boat ride over to good old Vietnam,after training at Ft.Lewis from Basic through AIT after unit training for ten months with the reliable M14,and to be issued a unreliable,weak weapon system was a foolish and dangerous mistake, Welcome Home Brothers.
I’m never off the subject of that “Mattie Mattel “ piece of junk we were issued back in 1966 on our boat ride over to good old Vietnam,after training at Ft.Lewis from Basic through AIT after unit training for ten months with the reliable M14,and to be issued a unreliable,weak weapon system was a foolish and dangerous mistake, Welcome Home Brothers.
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SP5 Delphis Kaczowski
Always remember the Military acronym for battle: THE 6P's; Poor Planning Produces Pssss Poor Performance.
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Capt Mark Miller
MacNamara thought recruiting from the Inner City/Ghetto would give them skills and money for a better life. Big Mistake.
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SGT Philip Roncari
Capt Mark Miller
I was one of those Inner City/Ghetto kids,certainly didn’t give me any skills,well yes ,in a sense since my first job leaving Uncle Sam’s army was a ditch digger for a local utility company,what I thought was criminal was the use of marginalized lower IQ people to fill the ranks for that lousy war,Welcome Home Brothers.
I was one of those Inner City/Ghetto kids,certainly didn’t give me any skills,well yes ,in a sense since my first job leaving Uncle Sam’s army was a ditch digger for a local utility company,what I thought was criminal was the use of marginalized lower IQ people to fill the ranks for that lousy war,Welcome Home Brothers.
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I served from 1968 to 1972. If a recruit was fat they were sent to the fat farm and there was a platoon for attitude reajustment. If they could not hack it, they did not graduate Boot Camp and were discharged.
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SGT Carl Blas
Same for me 72 to 75 at Bragg, the motivation platoon was called CCF (conduct correction facility) some that went there said, it worked for them to adjust their attitude. If CCF didn't work, they went to the brigg for who knows for how long, or what happened to you.
The Fat Farm did PT all day, and meals were adjusted to loose weight, if that didn't work, you were out. The guys did always try to help the Fat guys, giving them advise and taking them out to excersize more, to motivate them.
We always put the fat guys out front of the daily 2 or 5 mile run, to help them move and to keep running. Some fell out, Well, see you later.
The Fat Farm did PT all day, and meals were adjusted to loose weight, if that didn't work, you were out. The guys did always try to help the Fat guys, giving them advise and taking them out to excersize more, to motivate them.
We always put the fat guys out front of the daily 2 or 5 mile run, to help them move and to keep running. Some fell out, Well, see you later.
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SP5 Mark Welch
I also served from '68-70 because I decided to "volunteer" for the draft and do my 2 years of National Service. Interestingly it was the first day, 4/1/1968 that the Marine Corps was taking draftees. Out of 30 or so my room at the LA Induction Station, they took maybe 6. I did Basic at Ft Ord in Monterey and our company was probably 50/50 US/RA. I am commenting because I found the dedication level and effort expended to be very similar of both groups, although I didn't think much about it at the time. Our DI's and CO were making us into one unit and the CO was really serious about "no man left behind." It was then that I learned what being a soldier was all about. As it turned out in my case, I got my dream assignment to MI due to a language proficiency test I passed in Basic, and was sent to Germany for the rest of my 18 months in the service. Out of my 40 man POW Interrogator class at Ft Holabird in Baltimore, 3 of us were sent to Germany and the rest to Nam, no matter which language they spoke. I salute all who served during those years whether Draftee (US) or Regular Army (RA). Everyone of us signed a blank check to Uncle Sam and then did our duty. To those who actually served in Combat zones like Nam, I give the highest respect. Thank you all for your Service; in my case it was a pleasure to serve.
Sp 5 Mark Welch,
Vacaville, CA
Sp 5 Mark Welch,
Vacaville, CA
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Capt Mark Miller
SGT Carl Blas - Yep. Saw a guy sitting in the Brig at Lackland. Had a guy blow his brains outb on the range just before I got there in 1974.
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