Posted on Jun 5, 2016
Do you think the number 22 helps or hurts suicide awareness in the military community?
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Responses: 30
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My opinion is that any attention on the issue is "good attention". I understand the negative stigma the campaign brings to veterans, but am willing to carry the stigma if it focuses more attention/resources on mental healthcare for combat veterans.
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LTC (Join to see)
Do not forget sobriety. We forget, or if we drink socially, that some people it becomes a big habit. It seems nobody talks about problem drinking. It has been there in the US military since 1775. I never was a person who drank much and I have been sober for 11 years. My wife and I are in AA. My sister committed suicide at age 49 by her version of PTSD from an abortion and emotional issues combined with pain killers and being served divorce papers on her 3rd failed marriage.
In the summer of 2009 I went, for the hell of it since I was a wounded warrior mending a non-combat broken ankle from combatives while serving in Afghanistan, to an AA meeting on Joint Base Lewis-McCord and I was shocked to see command -directed soldiers and even a senior NCO with drinking issues and a former air force nco who got fired for being drunk on duty and drinking a bottle of wine in the morning just to function.
It blows my mind. In 2003, while on Title 32 active duty, I went with my commander and the 1SG on a health and welfare inspection of a soldier who pulled a roving patrol with other soldiers of Dugway Proving Ground and he left his rifle back at the barracks on a latrine break and he did not notice he left it when resuming the mobile patrol. We went a few days later and while inspecting his room we found he had some spiked gatorade that had scotch or whisky in it. Upon being discovered, he said he had a drinking problem and asked for help. This saved a court martial for having alcohol in the barracks.
We took him to the Police Station and we did a breathalizer test and he was .23 blood Alcohol level and he looked sober to me. He was like an Amy Winehouse drunk as a skunk and not showing it.
The stuff I see as an Army National Guard or Army Reservist with limited title 10 and title 32 experience. I can imagine how common it may be in the active component.
Just my concerns and opinion to mentor others not to drink or even get started.
CPT (Join to see) MAJ (Join to see) PFC Talal Al-Tunsi LTC John Shaw LTC Kevin B. LTC Stephen F. SGT Robert George SGT (Join to see) MAJ Laurie H. 2LT (Join to see) 1LT(P) Jake Ledgerwood MAJ David Potter COL John Cole COL Mikel J. Burroughs SSG Derrick L. Lewis MBA, C-HRM
SFC William Farrell SrA Christopher Wright @sfc SGM Erik Marquez CSM David Heidke CSM William DeWolf
In the summer of 2009 I went, for the hell of it since I was a wounded warrior mending a non-combat broken ankle from combatives while serving in Afghanistan, to an AA meeting on Joint Base Lewis-McCord and I was shocked to see command -directed soldiers and even a senior NCO with drinking issues and a former air force nco who got fired for being drunk on duty and drinking a bottle of wine in the morning just to function.
It blows my mind. In 2003, while on Title 32 active duty, I went with my commander and the 1SG on a health and welfare inspection of a soldier who pulled a roving patrol with other soldiers of Dugway Proving Ground and he left his rifle back at the barracks on a latrine break and he did not notice he left it when resuming the mobile patrol. We went a few days later and while inspecting his room we found he had some spiked gatorade that had scotch or whisky in it. Upon being discovered, he said he had a drinking problem and asked for help. This saved a court martial for having alcohol in the barracks.
We took him to the Police Station and we did a breathalizer test and he was .23 blood Alcohol level and he looked sober to me. He was like an Amy Winehouse drunk as a skunk and not showing it.
The stuff I see as an Army National Guard or Army Reservist with limited title 10 and title 32 experience. I can imagine how common it may be in the active component.
Just my concerns and opinion to mentor others not to drink or even get started.
CPT (Join to see) MAJ (Join to see) PFC Talal Al-Tunsi LTC John Shaw LTC Kevin B. LTC Stephen F. SGT Robert George SGT (Join to see) MAJ Laurie H. 2LT (Join to see) 1LT(P) Jake Ledgerwood MAJ David Potter COL John Cole COL Mikel J. Burroughs SSG Derrick L. Lewis MBA, C-HRM
SFC William Farrell SrA Christopher Wright @sfc SGM Erik Marquez CSM David Heidke CSM William DeWolf
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SPC Bridgette V.
very good to talk about these topics to assist others when trying to cope with the stigma
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I only recently learned that the vast majority of veteran suicides are attributable to Vietnam War vets. However, the whole PR effort to create awareness (tied to the number "22") has caused people to think that recent veterans of the Gulf War and Afghanistan are somehow defective and some employers are loathe to hire them. If this is not true, please let me know. If true, then it is time to have a discussion as to how this situation can be remedied.
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CAPT Kevin B.
Careful on comparisons Jack. NAM had stuff nothing before or since had, most notably Agent Orange. With your body being eaten up from the inside out, it pulled the will to live from many. Watched that happen time and time again. So circumstances can skew pretty much any overall number comparison.
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PO2 David Allender
CAPT Kevin B. - Vet. coming back from Iraq had gotten an unknown disease. Never heard if they ever found out what it was, but the vets were dying from it too.
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PO2 David Allender
I just read the other day on the internet that they estimate about 329 Nam Vets dying every day. Won't be long till all of us are gone at this rate.
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It's "statistically vague."
It doesn't say anything and is designed to evoke an emotional response without providing meaningful data. When I first heard it, my questions were:
1) How does that compare to the population at large? Lesser, Greater, Same?
2) Is this across all Eras of service? (it isn't, and further research shows many are "end of life" from Vietnam Era)
3) What is an "acceptable number?" It's great to say we are going to eliminate veteran suicide, but that's also an unrealistic goal, and unrealistic goals don't get accomplished. Therefore we REDUCE the number. However, when we change the verbiage... that implies some number is reasonable.
All this said, the number doesn't help. It's emotional, not logical. Emotional arguments are great for gaining awareness, but this one hides behind seemingly objective facts which allows it to be torn down further diluting its impact.
It doesn't say anything and is designed to evoke an emotional response without providing meaningful data. When I first heard it, my questions were:
1) How does that compare to the population at large? Lesser, Greater, Same?
2) Is this across all Eras of service? (it isn't, and further research shows many are "end of life" from Vietnam Era)
3) What is an "acceptable number?" It's great to say we are going to eliminate veteran suicide, but that's also an unrealistic goal, and unrealistic goals don't get accomplished. Therefore we REDUCE the number. However, when we change the verbiage... that implies some number is reasonable.
All this said, the number doesn't help. It's emotional, not logical. Emotional arguments are great for gaining awareness, but this one hides behind seemingly objective facts which allows it to be torn down further diluting its impact.
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