Posted on Apr 12, 2015
Does God exist? Or, is there a God?
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What are the best arguments for or against the existence of God?
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
God
Religion
Atheism
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 332
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1) Everything that began to exist had a cause.
2) The universe began to exist.
3) Therefore, the universe had a cause.
The most controversial premise is clearly premise 2. With the current paradigm of Big Bang cosmology, it is looking pretty good. Note that the argument does not yield the deity of most major religions. Further arguments would be required to augment that perspective. I personally believe in an impersonal deity, synonymous with the Logos/Fate/Providence of the ancient Stoics. Nevertheless, I believe careful philosophical reasoning makes metaphysical materialism untenable for many reasons.
2) The universe began to exist.
3) Therefore, the universe had a cause.
The most controversial premise is clearly premise 2. With the current paradigm of Big Bang cosmology, it is looking pretty good. Note that the argument does not yield the deity of most major religions. Further arguments would be required to augment that perspective. I personally believe in an impersonal deity, synonymous with the Logos/Fate/Providence of the ancient Stoics. Nevertheless, I believe careful philosophical reasoning makes metaphysical materialism untenable for many reasons.
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CPT (Join to see)
TSgt Christopher D. I am definitely tracking that the argument I presented is the Kalām cosmological argument. I do not tend to agree with Dr. William Lane Craig on any of his philosophical positions, but he is a brilliant philosopher and gifted speaker. I have read several of his books and articles, and I have enjoyed watching many of his debates on you tube. My opinion is that he absolutely demolishes his debating opponents. Like I stated previously, I don't agree with Dr. Craig's belief system, and I wouldn't necessarily defend the Kalām cosmological argument either. Nevertheless, his arguments should not be easily dismissed.
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TSgt Christopher D.
I would say that Dr. William Lane Craig is the foremost Christian apologist in the debate arena. That being said, the link contained a link to a rebuttal of the KCA. Here it is:
http://www.theaunicornist.com/2011/10/kalam-cosmological-argument-complete.html
http://www.theaunicornist.com/2011/10/kalam-cosmological-argument-complete.html
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Sgt Kelli Mays
yes...but how did the big bang happen? what caused it? or who caused it? Check out the movie God is not dead with Kevin Sorbo.... it brings this up and explains possibilities.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Sgt Kelli Mays - nothing caused it, that's one of the fallacies of religion, believing that everything MUST have a reason, which is entirely a human concept. Nothing HAS to have a reason, things happen because the laws of physics have played out. That's it. There doesn't have to be a reason for the universe to exist at all, other than the fact that there seems to be a tendency in the universe to fill in an area where there is relatively nothing, with something, simply because.
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Both of my parents are missionaries and I got to grow up overseas in missions for basically my entire life. I would say that I have seen to much to not believe in God, but that's my own take on the events of my life.
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TSgt (Join to see)
Cpl Robert Lowes certainly.
When I was six I remember meeting a man who was one of the premier highway robbers in the late '80s and early '90s in Papua New Guinea. He threw it all away after a drunk attempt to hold up an Austrailian who emptied an entire magazine towards him. He says he lived because a hand appeared between him and the bullets and stopped them. Then he jumped out of the way the Land Cruiser when the driver tried to run him down. He spent months looking for someone to tell hhim what happened and he stumbled on a gideon Bible and a pastor and the rest was history.
My father interviewed and filmed a woman who was dead for several days and then came back to life when I was nine or ten and I got to talk to her and see the footage which included interviews with her friends and enemies who confirmed it happened.
I've seen two fields in Cambodia. The first field was owned by a pastor who grows rice for the largest orphan care program in Cambodia, a program run entirely out of churches that are willing to take on the responsibility of building a house for the children and then employing widows from the local community to serve as the primary care givers for the children with the pastor and his wife (and they must be married to be allowed to take on orphan care), a program so successful it has UNICEF tripping over itself looking for something to tar it with because it makes them look so impotent. But I digress, the second field was owned by a good Buddhist monk. I don't have the photograph anymore but right down the line between the fields on the side of the pastor it is green and growing, on the other side it looked like the Dustbowl in the '20s and the only difference besides rain was the prayer of the orphans the pastor worked to feed.
Speaking of those orphans, Cambodia was in the middle of a bad drought back in 2006 if I remember correctly. Ted Olbrich, the missions mad man behind the orphan care in churches setup among many other things, was approached by some of the children and told that they had figured out how they were going to end the drought. He asked them what they had in mind and they told him they were going to talk to all the other orphans in all the other churches (they had about 3,000 in ~350 churches at that time) and they were all going to pray for rain. So he told them to go ahead and see what happened, the nhe went back to worrying and trying to figure out a plan for feeding ~3,000 kids on practically no funds since much of the money had been sunk into rice seed that was planted but on the edge of being lost from lack of water. Two weeks later they had to call the children and tell them, "Stop praying for rain. The fields are too wet and the rice is drowning."
Personally, the one that sits with me is one that happened the last year that I was in Papua New Guinea. It was 2003. Now you need to understand that PNG operates on "The Wantok System" which is a system of alliegence to Family, Tribe, Village, Language, Friend, Aquaintance, and "people you voted for" in roughly that order. Hence it is one of the most corrupt governments on Earth and has no solution in sight as long as the Wantok System remains. A pastor had a man in his village who was having some serious problems with life, the universe, and everything because those things refused to align to his preferences. This pastor went to talk to this man in his house up a hill. The man was hostile and abrasive but that didn't bother the pastor. What bothered the pastor was when he turned to leave he slipped and fell down. The house, being a fine example of Papua New Guinea Defensive Village Design (patent pending) was naturally located on a hillside. The pastor reached out and grabbed the doorframe so he wouldn't roll down the hill.
And the man grabbed the machete that he had leaning up against the wall by the door through the entire conversation and cut off the pastor's hand with it.
The pastor was rushed about three hourse to the nearest clinic where he arrived unconscious, with his wife holding his hand in yarn beanie. They saved his life but there was no way they were going to be able to save his hand. The extraordinary part is what happened before he was rushed to medical care. He stopped everyone in his village from going after the man who cut his hand off. They were ready to kill him. This is how the Nationals of PNG have dealt with their problems for thousands of years but he begged all the men in his village not to kill the young man who did that to him as blood was flowing from his stump and he was losing consciousness his first concern was that the people of his village not fall back into the cycle of violence that they were just getting out of.
I met that pastor within a week of him being released from the hospital he was taken to after his life was saved at the clinic he was initially brought to. And a month after he was out, he went to talk to the man who cut off his hand and he forgave him for doing that and went back to working with him on sorting out the other issues he had in his life.
THAT is whaty I am for God and Christianity. Sure I've got intellectual stuff to go along with it, but I don't give a fig about "good arguments" and "sound reasoning" if it doesn't match up to life when you hold them next to each other and compare the two. The kind of transforamation that happened to that pastor and then to his villlage in one generation is why I have no doubt that God exists. The issues that are so entrenched that you don't know how they can ever be solved or overcome just <b><i>vanish</i></b> when God intervenes.
I can tal kto my Dad if you want any details or more stories, this was off the top of my head and the details are fairly suspect but the main thrust is still intact and that's the whole point.
If you want more I'll be happy to oblige, but just like this one, it will end up lengthy.
When I was six I remember meeting a man who was one of the premier highway robbers in the late '80s and early '90s in Papua New Guinea. He threw it all away after a drunk attempt to hold up an Austrailian who emptied an entire magazine towards him. He says he lived because a hand appeared between him and the bullets and stopped them. Then he jumped out of the way the Land Cruiser when the driver tried to run him down. He spent months looking for someone to tell hhim what happened and he stumbled on a gideon Bible and a pastor and the rest was history.
My father interviewed and filmed a woman who was dead for several days and then came back to life when I was nine or ten and I got to talk to her and see the footage which included interviews with her friends and enemies who confirmed it happened.
I've seen two fields in Cambodia. The first field was owned by a pastor who grows rice for the largest orphan care program in Cambodia, a program run entirely out of churches that are willing to take on the responsibility of building a house for the children and then employing widows from the local community to serve as the primary care givers for the children with the pastor and his wife (and they must be married to be allowed to take on orphan care), a program so successful it has UNICEF tripping over itself looking for something to tar it with because it makes them look so impotent. But I digress, the second field was owned by a good Buddhist monk. I don't have the photograph anymore but right down the line between the fields on the side of the pastor it is green and growing, on the other side it looked like the Dustbowl in the '20s and the only difference besides rain was the prayer of the orphans the pastor worked to feed.
Speaking of those orphans, Cambodia was in the middle of a bad drought back in 2006 if I remember correctly. Ted Olbrich, the missions mad man behind the orphan care in churches setup among many other things, was approached by some of the children and told that they had figured out how they were going to end the drought. He asked them what they had in mind and they told him they were going to talk to all the other orphans in all the other churches (they had about 3,000 in ~350 churches at that time) and they were all going to pray for rain. So he told them to go ahead and see what happened, the nhe went back to worrying and trying to figure out a plan for feeding ~3,000 kids on practically no funds since much of the money had been sunk into rice seed that was planted but on the edge of being lost from lack of water. Two weeks later they had to call the children and tell them, "Stop praying for rain. The fields are too wet and the rice is drowning."
Personally, the one that sits with me is one that happened the last year that I was in Papua New Guinea. It was 2003. Now you need to understand that PNG operates on "The Wantok System" which is a system of alliegence to Family, Tribe, Village, Language, Friend, Aquaintance, and "people you voted for" in roughly that order. Hence it is one of the most corrupt governments on Earth and has no solution in sight as long as the Wantok System remains. A pastor had a man in his village who was having some serious problems with life, the universe, and everything because those things refused to align to his preferences. This pastor went to talk to this man in his house up a hill. The man was hostile and abrasive but that didn't bother the pastor. What bothered the pastor was when he turned to leave he slipped and fell down. The house, being a fine example of Papua New Guinea Defensive Village Design (patent pending) was naturally located on a hillside. The pastor reached out and grabbed the doorframe so he wouldn't roll down the hill.
And the man grabbed the machete that he had leaning up against the wall by the door through the entire conversation and cut off the pastor's hand with it.
The pastor was rushed about three hourse to the nearest clinic where he arrived unconscious, with his wife holding his hand in yarn beanie. They saved his life but there was no way they were going to be able to save his hand. The extraordinary part is what happened before he was rushed to medical care. He stopped everyone in his village from going after the man who cut his hand off. They were ready to kill him. This is how the Nationals of PNG have dealt with their problems for thousands of years but he begged all the men in his village not to kill the young man who did that to him as blood was flowing from his stump and he was losing consciousness his first concern was that the people of his village not fall back into the cycle of violence that they were just getting out of.
I met that pastor within a week of him being released from the hospital he was taken to after his life was saved at the clinic he was initially brought to. And a month after he was out, he went to talk to the man who cut off his hand and he forgave him for doing that and went back to working with him on sorting out the other issues he had in his life.
THAT is whaty I am for God and Christianity. Sure I've got intellectual stuff to go along with it, but I don't give a fig about "good arguments" and "sound reasoning" if it doesn't match up to life when you hold them next to each other and compare the two. The kind of transforamation that happened to that pastor and then to his villlage in one generation is why I have no doubt that God exists. The issues that are so entrenched that you don't know how they can ever be solved or overcome just <b><i>vanish</i></b> when God intervenes.
I can tal kto my Dad if you want any details or more stories, this was off the top of my head and the details are fairly suspect but the main thrust is still intact and that's the whole point.
If you want more I'll be happy to oblige, but just like this one, it will end up lengthy.
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Sgt Kelli Mays
Cpl Robert Lowes - please check out the movie GOd is not dead with Kevin Sorbo.... He was a believer then his mother passed and he became angry and hateful and a HUGE ATHEIST....then he had a student....and well...watch the movie and you'll see then decide.
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Sgt Kelli Mays
Cpl Robert Lowes - I understand...and please know I' am not trying to convince you to believe....the movie is a good one...and it' shows there is no absolute way of proving that God does not exist.
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I'm not an expert but there were times I should have been dead. Gets you thinking. Take a look at kids. They do stupid stuff every day that can get them killed, but for the most part it doesn't happen. Something is affecting the equation.
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SPC Nathan Freeman
An Estimate of the Probability for Attaining the Necessary Parameters for Life Support
Parameter Probability that feature will fall in the required range
galaxy size .1
galaxy type .1
galaxy location .1
star location relative to galactic center .2
star distance from closest spiral arm .1
z-axis extremes of star's orbit .1
proximity of solar nebula to a supernova eruption .01
timing of solar nebula formation relative to supernova eruption .01
number of stars in system .2
star birth date .2
star age .4
star metallicity .05
star orbital eccentricity .1
star's distance from galactic plane .1
star mass .001
star luminosity relative to speciation .0001
star color .4
3H+ production .1
supernovae rates and locations .01
white dwarf binary types, rates, and locations .01
planetary distance from star .001
inclination of planetary orbit .5
planetary axis tilt .3
rate of change of axial tilt .01
planetary rotation period .1
rate of change in planetary rotation period .05
planetary orbit eccentricity .3
surface gravity (escape velocity) .001
tidal force .1
magnetic field .01
albedo .1
density .1
planetary crust thickness .01
oceans-to-continents ratio .2
rate of change in oceans-to-continents ratio .1
global distribution of continents .3
frequency and extent of ice ages .1
asteroid and comet collision rate .1
change in asteroid and comet collision rates .1
mass of body colliding with primordial Earth .002
timing of collision with primordial Earth .05
rate of change in asteroid/comet collision rate .1
proximity and mass of Jupiter .01
major planet eccentricities .1
major planet orbital instabilities .1
drift rate and rate change of major planets .1
atmospheric transparency .01
atmospheric pressure .1
atmospheric electric discharge rate .1
atmospheric temperature gradient .01
carbon dioxide level in atmosphere .01
oxygen level in atmosphere .01
chlorine level in atmosphere .1
iron quantity in oceans .1
tropospheric ozone quantity .01
stratospheric ozone quantity .01
mesospheric ozone quantity .01
water vapor level in atmosphere .01
oxygen-to-nitrogen ratio in atmosphere .1
quantity of greenhouse gases in atmosphere .01
frequency and extent of forest and grass fires .01
soil mineralization .1
quantity of sea-salt aerosols .1
quantity of decomposer bacteria in soil .01
quantity of mycorrhizal fungi in soil .01
quantity of nitrifying microbes in soil .01
quantity of sulfur in soil .1
quantity of sulfur in planet's core .1
tectonic activity .1
volcanic activity .1
decline in volcanic activity .1
viscosity of Earth's core at core boundaries .01
biomass to comet-infall ratio .01
regularity of cometary infall .1
dependency factors (estimate) 100,000,000,000
longevity requirements (estimate) .00001
Probability for combined occurrence of all 75 parameters = 10-99
Maximum possible number of planets in universe = 1023
Taken from Ross, H. 1998. Big Bang Refined by Fire. Reasons To Believe, Pasadena, CA.
By putting together probabilities for each of these design features occurring by chance, we can calculate the probability of the existence of a planet like Earth. This probability is 1 chance in 1099. Since there are estimated to be a maximum of only 1023 planets in the universe (10 planets/star, see note below), by chance there shouldn't be any planets capable of supporting life in the universe. Our existence suggests divine intervention and design. The design and care with which the laws of physics, the universe, our galaxy, our solar system, and the planet Earth were crafted suggests that God is caring and loving. He put in a lot of time in the design and creation of the universe so that we would have a nice place to live for such a short period of time.
If that's not enough, I have more. This planet is no accident. It was planned for a purpose
Parameter Probability that feature will fall in the required range
galaxy size .1
galaxy type .1
galaxy location .1
star location relative to galactic center .2
star distance from closest spiral arm .1
z-axis extremes of star's orbit .1
proximity of solar nebula to a supernova eruption .01
timing of solar nebula formation relative to supernova eruption .01
number of stars in system .2
star birth date .2
star age .4
star metallicity .05
star orbital eccentricity .1
star's distance from galactic plane .1
star mass .001
star luminosity relative to speciation .0001
star color .4
3H+ production .1
supernovae rates and locations .01
white dwarf binary types, rates, and locations .01
planetary distance from star .001
inclination of planetary orbit .5
planetary axis tilt .3
rate of change of axial tilt .01
planetary rotation period .1
rate of change in planetary rotation period .05
planetary orbit eccentricity .3
surface gravity (escape velocity) .001
tidal force .1
magnetic field .01
albedo .1
density .1
planetary crust thickness .01
oceans-to-continents ratio .2
rate of change in oceans-to-continents ratio .1
global distribution of continents .3
frequency and extent of ice ages .1
asteroid and comet collision rate .1
change in asteroid and comet collision rates .1
mass of body colliding with primordial Earth .002
timing of collision with primordial Earth .05
rate of change in asteroid/comet collision rate .1
proximity and mass of Jupiter .01
major planet eccentricities .1
major planet orbital instabilities .1
drift rate and rate change of major planets .1
atmospheric transparency .01
atmospheric pressure .1
atmospheric electric discharge rate .1
atmospheric temperature gradient .01
carbon dioxide level in atmosphere .01
oxygen level in atmosphere .01
chlorine level in atmosphere .1
iron quantity in oceans .1
tropospheric ozone quantity .01
stratospheric ozone quantity .01
mesospheric ozone quantity .01
water vapor level in atmosphere .01
oxygen-to-nitrogen ratio in atmosphere .1
quantity of greenhouse gases in atmosphere .01
frequency and extent of forest and grass fires .01
soil mineralization .1
quantity of sea-salt aerosols .1
quantity of decomposer bacteria in soil .01
quantity of mycorrhizal fungi in soil .01
quantity of nitrifying microbes in soil .01
quantity of sulfur in soil .1
quantity of sulfur in planet's core .1
tectonic activity .1
volcanic activity .1
decline in volcanic activity .1
viscosity of Earth's core at core boundaries .01
biomass to comet-infall ratio .01
regularity of cometary infall .1
dependency factors (estimate) 100,000,000,000
longevity requirements (estimate) .00001
Probability for combined occurrence of all 75 parameters = 10-99
Maximum possible number of planets in universe = 1023
Taken from Ross, H. 1998. Big Bang Refined by Fire. Reasons To Believe, Pasadena, CA.
By putting together probabilities for each of these design features occurring by chance, we can calculate the probability of the existence of a planet like Earth. This probability is 1 chance in 1099. Since there are estimated to be a maximum of only 1023 planets in the universe (10 planets/star, see note below), by chance there shouldn't be any planets capable of supporting life in the universe. Our existence suggests divine intervention and design. The design and care with which the laws of physics, the universe, our galaxy, our solar system, and the planet Earth were crafted suggests that God is caring and loving. He put in a lot of time in the design and creation of the universe so that we would have a nice place to live for such a short period of time.
If that's not enough, I have more. This planet is no accident. It was planned for a purpose
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SPC (Join to see)
SPC Nathan Freeman I think you're contradicting yourself: ". . . we can calculate the probability of the existence of a planet like Earth. This probability is 1 chance in 1099."
Then: "by chance there shouldn't be any planets capable of supporting life in the universe."
So is there a chance, or isn't there?
Improbability of a thing proves there are gods how? This is a poor argument. When in science has a supernatural force ever been measured and/or empirically verified?
Then: "by chance there shouldn't be any planets capable of supporting life in the universe."
So is there a chance, or isn't there?
Improbability of a thing proves there are gods how? This is a poor argument. When in science has a supernatural force ever been measured and/or empirically verified?
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Yes God exists. How else can an opposing group deny him so vehemently? If you are truly a non-believer and hold to your convictions, why try and force your choice upon others? This is the stance I have never understood about atheists. If you do not believe, why do you care? Just my thoughts.
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CPT(P) David Thorp
ISIS executes Christians for not converting to Islam.
But the Christian god banishes you to a burning hell for all eternity if you do not accept Jesus Christ as your savior. We traumatize our children by telling them this. Its a ridiculous idea to project onto others.
Atheism poses no threat to humanity. In fact quite the opposite.
Religion does, and that's why they care to oppose it. Religon has us still fighting wars with each other when we should be looking out towards the stars. We have stepped foot on another world, sent probes to all the planets in our solar system, made amazing discoveries about the fabric of reality, the nature of existence, and yet we still kill each other down here Earth over disagreements about who the true Magic Sky Wizard is. We are still a primitive civilization and this is why the aliens won't talk to us.
I mean, what kind of all powerful, all-knowing, omnipotent God, creator of a universe with billions of galaxies, filled with trillions of stars and planets, would lower himself to look down on our tiny insignificant spec of a world and make Sandy Hook happen? I mean its all part of his plan right? Massacres of children? Genocide all across the world? To just say, "oh they are with God now, he needed them in heaven" is a cop out and does nothing to address the root of the problem.
But the Christian god banishes you to a burning hell for all eternity if you do not accept Jesus Christ as your savior. We traumatize our children by telling them this. Its a ridiculous idea to project onto others.
Atheism poses no threat to humanity. In fact quite the opposite.
Religion does, and that's why they care to oppose it. Religon has us still fighting wars with each other when we should be looking out towards the stars. We have stepped foot on another world, sent probes to all the planets in our solar system, made amazing discoveries about the fabric of reality, the nature of existence, and yet we still kill each other down here Earth over disagreements about who the true Magic Sky Wizard is. We are still a primitive civilization and this is why the aliens won't talk to us.
I mean, what kind of all powerful, all-knowing, omnipotent God, creator of a universe with billions of galaxies, filled with trillions of stars and planets, would lower himself to look down on our tiny insignificant spec of a world and make Sandy Hook happen? I mean its all part of his plan right? Massacres of children? Genocide all across the world? To just say, "oh they are with God now, he needed them in heaven" is a cop out and does nothing to address the root of the problem.
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MSgt Chris Adams
Cpl Robert Lowes Didn't think my brush was that broad, but isn't the group forceful? Atheists are a minority group who have been able to force changes in the way things are done when they have no belief it what they took steps to change. Similar in the force used by other minority movements.
The tactic? Voice an opposing view, label the "offending voice" as a bigot/racist/-phobe/etc/etc. Be consistent or more forceful with the argument, be corralled in the same circle as Westboro Baptist.
Agreed, communication is a learning tool. And I pass on my condolences for your friend.
The tactic? Voice an opposing view, label the "offending voice" as a bigot/racist/-phobe/etc/etc. Be consistent or more forceful with the argument, be corralled in the same circle as Westboro Baptist.
Agreed, communication is a learning tool. And I pass on my condolences for your friend.
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CW3 (Join to see)
because of the countless dead due do religious fervor
because believing in something that is not provable but exists singularly in your brain is shockingly similar to mental illness
because not believing things that are not proven to be true isn't a choice, it's common sense
because you just like are an Atheist, the only difference is I take it one god further. (Where are those ice giants Odin said he would the world of, just sayin he held up his end of the deal)
Because Atheists are not an opposing group, you can't oppose something that doesn't exist, like unicorns
Because they are not convictions, they are the immutable laws od physics.
etc. etc. etc. etc.
because believing in something that is not provable but exists singularly in your brain is shockingly similar to mental illness
because not believing things that are not proven to be true isn't a choice, it's common sense
because you just like are an Atheist, the only difference is I take it one god further. (Where are those ice giants Odin said he would the world of, just sayin he held up his end of the deal)
Because Atheists are not an opposing group, you can't oppose something that doesn't exist, like unicorns
Because they are not convictions, they are the immutable laws od physics.
etc. etc. etc. etc.
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Without a doubt he lives, loves and reigns over us! Gods love is unlike any other and if only we took the time to understand his love and grace, could so many others come to know him. I could talk forever on this topic and would be happy to expand for any who are curious to know more. God is everywhere and his love never fails!
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I went an entire career never being asked what my religion was and never asking that of any of my soldiers. I bowed my head out of respect for military custom and courtesy before I found God. I did not feel the obligation to pitch a fit or try to make everyone else bend to my side. Bullets don't have religious preference and I still have yet to meet an athiest under fire. I don't want to add to the bank accounts of these special interest groups who sue the sueable to win monetarty awards and continue to make mountains out of mole hills as they "champion" the rights of the individual. I didn't join the military to be an individual! I joined to serve my country and to protect ALL (I say again) ALL Americans. Go ahead and be an individual. "That's not my bag, baby." Let's continue to alienate ourselves until we have the "perfect military." OR......OR.....OR.................we continue kicking butt as a cohesive organization accepting everyone who protects our flanks! Someone touched a nerve, and I'm just getting started............
Try to see this from the EO (Equal Opportunity) perspective and more importantly, Uncle Mark's key to survival and victory due to superior numbers on the battlefield......Let's say I am going to drop your butt off on some crap mountain top in Iraqistan and you will be on your own. We have 10,000 people at our command, but YOU have it in your head that you are only taking the ones that fit your "perfect fighting force." Let your own discrimination and bias direct your decision making. I don't want ANY women in MY perfect world! I don't want ANY athiests, Jews, or Muslims in MY perfect world! I don't want any POG's (person other-than grunt) watching MY back! You better be native born and speak english as a first language in MY perfect world! I hate young-a$$ punks, so no one under 21 in MY perfect world! I F!@##$ing HATE college boys!!!! No college boys in MY perfect world! Every squad MUST have a Ranger in MY perfect world! Etc, etc.
I have now offended, dismissed, and disregarded over 98% (Merino math) of my available assets to create MY perfect world of hard corp fire pissers. There are now 200 available for combat. I hate to break it to you, but nobody is coming home alive. Your mission is a failure; and you can point all the fingers you want. Your perfect world is still in ashes.
Think BIG picture. The military is trying to strengthen your numbers, not weaken them. If you can't handle the change, get out. You served honorably. But it is you who needs to adapt and overcome. Your quest for individuality is not conducive to the military. Start a militia of good old boys and run things your way. One Team, One Fight!
Try to see this from the EO (Equal Opportunity) perspective and more importantly, Uncle Mark's key to survival and victory due to superior numbers on the battlefield......Let's say I am going to drop your butt off on some crap mountain top in Iraqistan and you will be on your own. We have 10,000 people at our command, but YOU have it in your head that you are only taking the ones that fit your "perfect fighting force." Let your own discrimination and bias direct your decision making. I don't want ANY women in MY perfect world! I don't want ANY athiests, Jews, or Muslims in MY perfect world! I don't want any POG's (person other-than grunt) watching MY back! You better be native born and speak english as a first language in MY perfect world! I hate young-a$$ punks, so no one under 21 in MY perfect world! I F!@##$ing HATE college boys!!!! No college boys in MY perfect world! Every squad MUST have a Ranger in MY perfect world! Etc, etc.
I have now offended, dismissed, and disregarded over 98% (Merino math) of my available assets to create MY perfect world of hard corp fire pissers. There are now 200 available for combat. I hate to break it to you, but nobody is coming home alive. Your mission is a failure; and you can point all the fingers you want. Your perfect world is still in ashes.
Think BIG picture. The military is trying to strengthen your numbers, not weaken them. If you can't handle the change, get out. You served honorably. But it is you who needs to adapt and overcome. Your quest for individuality is not conducive to the military. Start a militia of good old boys and run things your way. One Team, One Fight!
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PO2 Rev. Frederick C. Mullis, AFI, CFM
Hey SARGE, They did ask me one time, When they were filling out the Info for my Dog Tags. They told me there was not enough room for "Brown Eyed Devil" So I had them put Christian.
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Yes, I believe he does. But ultimately this is why we call it faith. You have to believe, and take a leap of faith.
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Sir, that doesn't answer the question though. Just because you believe something, never has, does not now, nor will it ever make it true. That line of reasoning gives just as much justification to the existence of every other god ~3K that humans have ever created or still hold true. And ALL of them do not allow for any other to be true. Just faith or belief alone does nothing to answer this. Children believe in things they cannot prove, not adults.
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SGT Mark Sullivan thank you for your honesty. I was raised as an agnostic and had a very early desire to approach life using the scientific method in the physical sciences. I have always liked to dig into evidence. One of the beauties of living in the age in which we live is that archaeological evidence is being unearthed in so many areas of this planet. The net result is that previous theories, dogmas and hypotheses can be challenged if sufficient evidence is uncovered by using the scientific method.
Many people who have not looked at the ample evidence believe that translations of ancient works including the books of the Bible rely on other translations when there are so many ancient manuscripts available to go back to. You are probably not aware of the Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament [currently number 28] process which compares new evidence with the copious ancient documents already available. These scholars are working to develop the most reliable copy of the Greek New Testament. The work has focused on resolving spelling variations and word order variations. The translation committees that work on updating extant versions of the Bible and developing new versions use the Nestle-Aland committees work to supplement their own research. Because English and Spanish and many other languages change over time, effort is made to update ancient texts, including the Bible, to be more easily understood by the generations that will be reading the texts. The goal is to make the ancient text understood as well as possible. Some processes use a word for word emphasis from original languages to receptor languages while others use primarily a thought by thought approach. Many ancient documents were written in various near and middle eastern scripts and languages which are very different from English, Spanish, etc. translation needs to be more nuanced than translating between languages of the same language group.
Personally like the quixotic Don Quixote I fought God like tilting at windmills. However I actively fought his messengers and His message. Each of us needs to do our own research and soul searching. If you honestly seek, God will reveal Himself to you in His way uniquely intended for you because He knows exactly what you need to know.
SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
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Many people who have not looked at the ample evidence believe that translations of ancient works including the books of the Bible rely on other translations when there are so many ancient manuscripts available to go back to. You are probably not aware of the Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament [currently number 28] process which compares new evidence with the copious ancient documents already available. These scholars are working to develop the most reliable copy of the Greek New Testament. The work has focused on resolving spelling variations and word order variations. The translation committees that work on updating extant versions of the Bible and developing new versions use the Nestle-Aland committees work to supplement their own research. Because English and Spanish and many other languages change over time, effort is made to update ancient texts, including the Bible, to be more easily understood by the generations that will be reading the texts. The goal is to make the ancient text understood as well as possible. Some processes use a word for word emphasis from original languages to receptor languages while others use primarily a thought by thought approach. Many ancient documents were written in various near and middle eastern scripts and languages which are very different from English, Spanish, etc. translation needs to be more nuanced than translating between languages of the same language group.
Personally like the quixotic Don Quixote I fought God like tilting at windmills. However I actively fought his messengers and His message. Each of us needs to do our own research and soul searching. If you honestly seek, God will reveal Himself to you in His way uniquely intended for you because He knows exactly what you need to know.
SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
SGT Jinger Jarrett
Peter Armstrong
MAJ Robert AuBuchon
CH (COL) Geoff Bailey
SPC Mark Beard
CH (MAJ) William Beaver
MSgt (Join to see)
SGT (Join to see)
SSG Selwyn Bodley
LTC (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see)
PO1 Stephen Caldonetti
SPC Danny Cannon
MSG Martin C.
1SG Robert C.
Sgt Christopher Collins
CH (CPT) (Join to see)
SSG Lawrence Crow
Sgt Carroll Day
SFC (CA) Roland Dell
CH (MAJ) (Join to see)
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2LT (Join to see)
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SGT Efaw (Mick) G.
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PO1 Michael G.
LCDR (Join to see)
MSG R. Keith Hall
SGT Tony Lee Hamilton
SSG Coy Harris
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SGT Robert Hawks
SSG Jay Henning
SSgt Alexander Ingram
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CW3 Bradley Keiser
CPT (Join to see)
SSG Buddy Kemper
Cpl Kelly Kendall
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SFC Walter Klein, Jr.
SSgt Terry Kohler
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Tony Lewis
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Looks like there is someone who just likes to hear herself argue TSgt Hunter Logan
Big Tough Woman got her big panties on.
What I don't get SGT Jinger Jarrett is that YOU responded to LTC Stephen F. thread, therefore he has the right to come back and refute your comment if he wants to. Just like you have the right to be an adult and shut the hell up and go onto another thread. There are many more that has nothing to do with God. Take your happy pills and Move Out! Get over yourself and your angry attitude. Adjust! Jesus Christ.
PV2 (Join to see) Some women I tell ya. Don't take your hormones out on other people. What-the-fuk-ever....
Big Tough Woman got her big panties on.
What I don't get SGT Jinger Jarrett is that YOU responded to LTC Stephen F. thread, therefore he has the right to come back and refute your comment if he wants to. Just like you have the right to be an adult and shut the hell up and go onto another thread. There are many more that has nothing to do with God. Take your happy pills and Move Out! Get over yourself and your angry attitude. Adjust! Jesus Christ.
PV2 (Join to see) Some women I tell ya. Don't take your hormones out on other people. What-the-fuk-ever....
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I'm sorry you feel that way SGT Jinger Jarrett. I really do not care about your religious preferences, I was only making sure you are ok. I'm sorry that you are so angry and have been betrayed. No matter what you may think, I do care, and I wish you well no matter what.
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