Posted on Mar 17, 2021
How will the military handle the conundrum with the Catholic Church and same sex marriages?
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Have to toss this out there - being Roman Catholic. Had to dig deep, please feel free to pass around to the masses!
The Department of Defense (DoD) now has a conundrum with same sex marriage on its hands, due to the newer policies of the Biden Administration, as the Pope recently stated that same sex marriages are barred. With the new administration in office, same sex marriages are now permitted and acceptable. This raises several difficult question(s) for the militaries Religious Services as a whole, and I will explain.
1) Are Chaplains/Deacons now not permitted to marry same sex due to their own religion, or religious faith, morals and values as dictated by the church?
2) Are Chaplains/Deacons now eligible to be prosecuted for not following lawful orders from higher under UCMJ or observed to be immune?
3) Due to Catholicism now undergoing a major change, if barred, and if DoD accepts and modifies its mandates, should other religions be permitted to marry, or are all religions now to barred?
I have come to remain neutral on the matter as every era has its changes. When I was younger in my 20s, honestly, I was against - out of the woodwork with "Don't Ask, Don't Tell", folks just started popping up, left and right. No choice in the matter serving, I slowly started accepting change and now am neutral with the matter - as can't change it, roll with it!
I bring to light these questions, and I'll pose another with Muslims and being able to marry up to 4-wives. Why not permit? Obviously, the DoD wants to include what society has seemingly come to accept with some activity, but Catholicism has yet to take on. However, Muslim activities are held back by the DoD, e.g., 4-wives... Why?
I myself find it rather funny with what is acceptable, and what not, when it comes to religious activity and what is considered immoral.
And SO, my ask a question -
One must ask, where does/should the DoD draw the line with crossing Religion and religious matters of morality and/or now having to deal with actions against those whom may/might not want to, rather cannot, due to their religion, permit? And, why is it now okay for some matters of moral/immoral activity, for some, but not all?
Am interested to read folks opinions on the matter - HOWEVER, BE KIND AND RESPECTFUL OF ONE ANOTHER, THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HEATED TOPIC FOR SOME!!!
https://apnews.com/article/vatican-decree-same-sex-unions-cannot-bless-sin-077944750c975313ad253328e4cf7443
The Department of Defense (DoD) now has a conundrum with same sex marriage on its hands, due to the newer policies of the Biden Administration, as the Pope recently stated that same sex marriages are barred. With the new administration in office, same sex marriages are now permitted and acceptable. This raises several difficult question(s) for the militaries Religious Services as a whole, and I will explain.
1) Are Chaplains/Deacons now not permitted to marry same sex due to their own religion, or religious faith, morals and values as dictated by the church?
2) Are Chaplains/Deacons now eligible to be prosecuted for not following lawful orders from higher under UCMJ or observed to be immune?
3) Due to Catholicism now undergoing a major change, if barred, and if DoD accepts and modifies its mandates, should other religions be permitted to marry, or are all religions now to barred?
I have come to remain neutral on the matter as every era has its changes. When I was younger in my 20s, honestly, I was against - out of the woodwork with "Don't Ask, Don't Tell", folks just started popping up, left and right. No choice in the matter serving, I slowly started accepting change and now am neutral with the matter - as can't change it, roll with it!
I bring to light these questions, and I'll pose another with Muslims and being able to marry up to 4-wives. Why not permit? Obviously, the DoD wants to include what society has seemingly come to accept with some activity, but Catholicism has yet to take on. However, Muslim activities are held back by the DoD, e.g., 4-wives... Why?
I myself find it rather funny with what is acceptable, and what not, when it comes to religious activity and what is considered immoral.
And SO, my ask a question -
One must ask, where does/should the DoD draw the line with crossing Religion and religious matters of morality and/or now having to deal with actions against those whom may/might not want to, rather cannot, due to their religion, permit? And, why is it now okay for some matters of moral/immoral activity, for some, but not all?
Am interested to read folks opinions on the matter - HOWEVER, BE KIND AND RESPECTFUL OF ONE ANOTHER, THIS IS AN EXTREMELY HEATED TOPIC FOR SOME!!!
https://apnews.com/article/vatican-decree-same-sex-unions-cannot-bless-sin-077944750c975313ad253328e4cf7443
Posted in these groups: 
DoDCatholic CharitiesCatholic Charities of the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston
DoDCatholic CharitiesCatholic Charities of the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 8
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Thank you my friend SGT Jim Ramge, MBA for posting a thoughtful question.
1. As those of us very familiar with history understand, the laws of the land don't always seem reasonable and often don't line up with the tenets of faith in Christianity, Judaism, and even Islam [where Muslims are a minority as in this nation].
2. Objections due to conscience have been upheld at the supreme court for limited issues such as being forced to perform induced abortions, forced to counsel for or against induced abortion.
3. Doing what is right, noble and true to your faith often comes at a cost - from freedom to jail.
4. Individual chaplains and the faith they represent will need to come t terms for what they will do. Hopefully as in induced abortion, as long as there are chaplains who can perform a ceremony in good conscience then I hope those whose faith prohibits them form performing said ceremony will be permitted to do so.
FYI Maj Bill Smith, Ph.D. MAJ Dale E. Wilson, Ph.D. PO1 H Gene Lawrence SMSgt David A Asbury TSgt David L. CH (MAJ) William Beaver SMSgt Lawrence McCarter SGT Steve McFarland PO2 (Join to see) PO2 Frederick Dunn SPC Michael Duricko, Ph.D SSG Franklin Briant SFC Chuck Martinez LTC (Join to see) LTC Wayne Brandon SGT James Murphy
1. As those of us very familiar with history understand, the laws of the land don't always seem reasonable and often don't line up with the tenets of faith in Christianity, Judaism, and even Islam [where Muslims are a minority as in this nation].
2. Objections due to conscience have been upheld at the supreme court for limited issues such as being forced to perform induced abortions, forced to counsel for or against induced abortion.
3. Doing what is right, noble and true to your faith often comes at a cost - from freedom to jail.
4. Individual chaplains and the faith they represent will need to come t terms for what they will do. Hopefully as in induced abortion, as long as there are chaplains who can perform a ceremony in good conscience then I hope those whose faith prohibits them form performing said ceremony will be permitted to do so.
FYI Maj Bill Smith, Ph.D. MAJ Dale E. Wilson, Ph.D. PO1 H Gene Lawrence SMSgt David A Asbury TSgt David L. CH (MAJ) William Beaver SMSgt Lawrence McCarter SGT Steve McFarland PO2 (Join to see) PO2 Frederick Dunn SPC Michael Duricko, Ph.D SSG Franklin Briant SFC Chuck Martinez LTC (Join to see) LTC Wayne Brandon SGT James Murphy
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SGT Jim Ramge, MBA
PO2 Frederick Dunn - Fred, my first thought is this, our Constitution was written under those men whom had Christian beliefs. But as we drift further and further into a nation of age, we move away from what, I believe, personally that is, for those whom signed the Declaration had intended - however, stated, that is why we have SCOTUS, to ensure that we stay true to the signatory wishes of the original penned Declaration - LOL!
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SGT Jim Ramge, MBA
LTC Stephen F. - My Friend & Brother Stephen, knew I could count on you to keep me straight! I just thought I’d ask as question as it arose in the news... Did know it seems the the DoD had already hashed this one out years ago, or so it seems.
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There is no conundrum here. The Pope said the Catholic church will not bless same sex marriages. Chaplains are not required to perform marriages by the military that is a personal decision for them. Performing marriage is not one of their official duties, ministering and spiritual health are. The Catholic church has said they will accept same sex couples, just not perform the marriages.
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SGT Jim Ramge, MBA
Thank you for the information Jason! I've been away from the Church for a bit, but years ago, when the Pope spoke, it was kind of like Gospel - pun intended!
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Well first off, in regards to marriage. The clergy simply perform a ceremony to make the marriage fit within the religion, but nothing legally happens. It is the town/county that legally marries people and that is what is used by DEERS to handle who is married to whom in the DoD - regardless of which or if any religion was involved. So it really doesn't matter to the DoD what a religion says.
You can't legally be married to more than one person at a time in the US, despite what a religion might say, the government only allows 1 and recognizes 1.
You can't legally be married to more than one person at a time in the US, despite what a religion might say, the government only allows 1 and recognizes 1.
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SGT Jim Ramge, MBA
Jeff, have to agree to disagree with your statement on the clergy, DEERS and DoD, for my time and prior, we were permitted to get married in the church on base. My parents are still in DEERS as proof. That said, rules change, and I can agree if they have, and will! Where my contention is with as some have stated within the last 24-hrs, is that those serving have orders, and would basically face UCMJ for not performing their duty.
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CW2 (Join to see)
SGT Jim Ramge, MBA - I'm not 100% on the time period but even when having clergy officiate a wedding, it's the marriage license applied for through the governing body that is the actual marriage.
When it comes down to it, the persons getting married are making a CHOICE to use clergy in their wedding, it is not required. Religion is, and always will be, a private matter and only is an issue to people (clergy or general population) because they choose to let it be an issue.
When it comes down to it, the persons getting married are making a CHOICE to use clergy in their wedding, it is not required. Religion is, and always will be, a private matter and only is an issue to people (clergy or general population) because they choose to let it be an issue.
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SGT Jim Ramge, MBA
Thank you for the clarification - done it twice and never paid attention I guess as the women had to do all the planning for some reason, LOL!
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