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I have been dealing with this a lot. I have seen both ways. As per AR 600–25 the junior person should salute. I see a 1LT senior to a 2LT and I salute them. I have seen many instances where this does not happen. Most see a LT as a LT regardless of being a 1st or 2nd. How do you all feel about this?
"B. All Army personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled to the salute. Salutes will be exchanged between officers (commissioned and warrant) and enlisted personnel, and with personnel of the Armed Forces of the United States..."
"B. All Army personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled to the salute. Salutes will be exchanged between officers (commissioned and warrant) and enlisted personnel, and with personnel of the Armed Forces of the United States..."
Officers
Customs and Courtesies
Army
Saluting
AR 600-25
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 1296
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I've been told on frequent occasions by some 1LTs to not salute them because "We are both Lts". Makes no sense to me...an O2 is senior to a O1, so why wouldn't I salute them or render respect to them? The regulation is the regulation...not to mention it is common sense to show proper respect to someone who is senior to you. I am not sure where the idea of not saluting a senior LT came from, but it makes no sense to me. You can't be wrong showing respect, but you can be wrong by not showing respect. Too easy.
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SSgt Kevin Hopkins
at this point do we really need a regulation to show respect? this is just beating a dead horse
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It bothers me that a question like this would ever arise. The military is built off of the need to function as one "well oiled" unit. We "all" were brought up in our services to honor and respect the traditions of our services and the US military, as a whole. The salute is rendered from the enlisted to the officer and all junior officers "should be" expected to render to his/her senior officer.
One legend has it that today’s military salute descended from the medieval knight's gesture of raising his visor to reveal his identity as a courtesy on the approach of a superior. From earliest times and in many distant armies throughout history, the right hand (or "weapon hand") has been raised as a greeting of friendship. The idea may have been to show that you weren't ready to use a rock or other weapon. The following explanation of the origin of the hand salute is perhaps closest to the truth: It was a long-established military custom for juniors to remove their headgear in the presence of superiors. In the British Army as late as the American Revolution a soldier saluted bv removing his hat. But with the advent of more cumbersome headgear in the 18th and 19th centuries, the act of removing one’s hat was gradually converted into the simpler gesture of grasping the visor, and issuing a courteous salutation. From there it finally became conventionalized into something resembling our modern hand salute. While, some historians believe it began in late Roman times when assassinations were common. A citizen who wanted to see a public official had to approach with his right hand raised to show that he did not hold a weapon.
Military personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled (by grade) to a salute except when it is inappropriate or impractical (in public conveyances such as planes and buses, in public places such as inside theaters, or when driving a vehicle).
Persons Entitled to a Salute
The President of the United States (Commander-in-Chief)
Commissioned Officers and Warrant Officers
Any Medal of Honor Recipient
Officers of Friendly Foreign Countries
A salute is also rendered:
When the United States National Anthem, "To the Color," "Hail to the Chief," or foreign national anthems are played.
To uncased National Color outdoors.
On ceremonial occasions (such as Change of Command, and Military Parades).
At reveille and retreat ceremonies, during the raising or lowering of the flag.
During the sounding of honors.
When the Pledge of Allegiance to the U.S. flag is being recited outdoors.
When turning over control of formations.
When rendering reports.
Like I indicated, we are a military long steeped in our traditions, lets not change it for something that need not be.
(And yes, I copied and pasted)
One legend has it that today’s military salute descended from the medieval knight's gesture of raising his visor to reveal his identity as a courtesy on the approach of a superior. From earliest times and in many distant armies throughout history, the right hand (or "weapon hand") has been raised as a greeting of friendship. The idea may have been to show that you weren't ready to use a rock or other weapon. The following explanation of the origin of the hand salute is perhaps closest to the truth: It was a long-established military custom for juniors to remove their headgear in the presence of superiors. In the British Army as late as the American Revolution a soldier saluted bv removing his hat. But with the advent of more cumbersome headgear in the 18th and 19th centuries, the act of removing one’s hat was gradually converted into the simpler gesture of grasping the visor, and issuing a courteous salutation. From there it finally became conventionalized into something resembling our modern hand salute. While, some historians believe it began in late Roman times when assassinations were common. A citizen who wanted to see a public official had to approach with his right hand raised to show that he did not hold a weapon.
Military personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled (by grade) to a salute except when it is inappropriate or impractical (in public conveyances such as planes and buses, in public places such as inside theaters, or when driving a vehicle).
Persons Entitled to a Salute
The President of the United States (Commander-in-Chief)
Commissioned Officers and Warrant Officers
Any Medal of Honor Recipient
Officers of Friendly Foreign Countries
A salute is also rendered:
When the United States National Anthem, "To the Color," "Hail to the Chief," or foreign national anthems are played.
To uncased National Color outdoors.
On ceremonial occasions (such as Change of Command, and Military Parades).
At reveille and retreat ceremonies, during the raising or lowering of the flag.
During the sounding of honors.
When the Pledge of Allegiance to the U.S. flag is being recited outdoors.
When turning over control of formations.
When rendering reports.
Like I indicated, we are a military long steeped in our traditions, lets not change it for something that need not be.
(And yes, I copied and pasted)
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TSgt (Join to see)
By the way, when in uniform, out and about, when a child has rendered me a salute, I have return it. As I am bound to my military training and honor to return a salute I am given: it shows we honor our traditions.
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CPT (Join to see)
True however there is a deeper sense in this. The regulation vs the unofficial custom. I have never found a 1LT that has corrected a 2LT. Nor have I corrected a 2LT for not saluting me. If I were in a superior position such as an CO, or maybe a XO, that might impact the situation.
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Absolutely! A salute is to be rendered by all subordinate ranking officers as well as all enlisted to all officers. I took great pride in informing all officers that my salute was a respect to their rank and that it required a salute in return.
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Suspended Profile
BLUF: Yes, if you are out ranked, you render the officer a salute. Now...if you're all PLs together, or in the same staff section, the LT mafia should kick in, and you all should be on good terms. Just remember, whenever you are not in your own home (unit, base) you should play by the regs and go from there.
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COL Randall C.
SFC (Join to see) Yeah ... it's a mismash of feel good spices (or feel bad...) thrown into an information environment :)
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It is the right thing to do. Similar to standing at parade rest for an NCO that is senior to you. Personally, I stand at parade rest for a SSG that is my PLT SGT, until they say i don't have to. It's proper respect for the position and i definately stand at parade rest for any NCO SFC or above. So, yes. A 2LT should salute a 1LT.
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In my Experience as a CWO there are 2 unwritten rules:
1) Once in the morning and once in the evening
2) single bars do not salute single bars unless they are directly your superior.
When troops are around refer to the regs.
1) Once in the morning and once in the evening
2) single bars do not salute single bars unless they are directly your superior.
When troops are around refer to the regs.
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SFC Michael W.
Sorry sir, but unless the bars you're referring to serves alcohol then they should "set the example" to follow...no exceptions. :)
Regs are not set on a schedule which you can decide when to follow or enforce them, they are in effect 24/7 until superceded or terminated. If not, then what's the point of having them?
Regs are not set on a schedule which you can decide when to follow or enforce them, they are in effect 24/7 until superceded or terminated. If not, then what's the point of having them?
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1SG (Join to see)
but you've added meaning that is not there. It does not say any person will salute anyone in a higher grade.
MAJ Carl Ballinger I paraphrased to get my point across of what I the reader understands from reading it. But what it does say and this is an exact cut and paste job
Army personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled (by grade) to a salute.
MAJ Carl Ballinger I paraphrased to get my point across of what I the reader understands from reading it. But what it does say and this is an exact cut and paste job
Army personnel in uniform are required to salute when they meet and recognize persons entitled (by grade) to a salute.
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1SG (Join to see)
But yet you are arguing the point MAJ Carl Ballinger I have even witnessed where you called someone ignorant on this thread because of their opinion (as you like to call it). You will never have 100% of the Army to agree with you Sir and neither will I.
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1SG (Join to see)
Sir, Regulations are known for not being the best written. You know as well as I do that if one officer outranks the other (by grade[as written in the TC]) then they salute. The lower grade salutes the higher. By your opinion of what the reg really means, is saying that you (as MAJ Ballinger) doesn't have to Salute a LTC (one grade higher). Good luck with that mode of thinking Sir! And if that is not your mode of thinking then please explain how it differs from the LT scenario (one grade higher)
As with everything in the Army, regulations can't be written to capture every single little thing, and leaders are supposed to be there to provide clear guidance to their subordinates, when the regulation is not clear to them. So let's quit playing with the poorly written manual, and submit a change to the manual or let's do as we were all taught and salute officers that are senior to us.
As with everything in the Army, regulations can't be written to capture every single little thing, and leaders are supposed to be there to provide clear guidance to their subordinates, when the regulation is not clear to them. So let's quit playing with the poorly written manual, and submit a change to the manual or let's do as we were all taught and salute officers that are senior to us.
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I've heard both sides of this question. However, it is Army culture for LT's NOT to salute one another. The bottom line is that they are both lieutenants. Besides, 1LT isn't even a real promotion. As my CG told me when I promoted to CPT, "welcome to the officer corp". He then explained that CPT was the first real rank in the officer corp. So, LTs, get over it. Do your time. Those 2LTs are going to be CPTs with you in a few years.
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CPT (Join to see)
I am not sure how the CG would say that. Maybe in the Army Reserve where they don't have Combat Arms but I lead a platoon of infantry. I am charged with everything they do and fail to do. I like to think I am an officer as I am in making decisions that may result in my men coming back home alive or in body bags. I wouldn't want to be a LT in such an outfit.
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He is greeted with puzzled looks and "WHAT!?!?" does this mean I have to stand at attention for him too?
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I don't care really, but I'm sure he makes other LT's sake him.
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A 2LT should have wooden dowels strapped to his/her legs and back to keep them stiff and standing at attention and they should crazy glue their right hand to their eyebrow in salute until they are pinned 1LT. SMH
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Does a light colonel salute a full bird? Does an E-7 stand at parade rest when addressing an E-8? It depends on the situation sometimes,how well you know them and what you are talking to them about or who is with you or who is there to see
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SSG Darin McNeely
I knew 2LT that saluted 1LT but the 1LT would say it's not necessary. And in many units it seems they were more friends.Walking along on post absolutely I didn't mean that it is that way in general, and most of my time was field time and that's a different thing all together.
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COL Eric Holmes
Two friends bump into each other on the street. They naturally say hi. The salute can be the same form of respect and endearment. Saluting is a reflection of a personal healthy attitude. If someone has a stigma that saluting is demeaning, than that too is a reflection of one's personal attitude.
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Just so you know I haven't been pinned yet. I will be pinned in a couple of days and I am heading down to Fort Stewart for a couple of weeks. I will vote then.
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CPT (Join to see)
I was in Ranger school the past few month and I just got my orders for the promotion the other week. They back dated my promotion to the 18 month mark. Otherwise I have lost time through no fault of my own. I was just going to start wearing it but they wanted to do a pinning thing.
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SPC Charles Brown
This may cause me problems, but here we go. If as a Corporal I have to salute a new 2nd LT, and with having more time in the chow line than a new 2nd LT has in service I had better see the 2nd LT salute his superior officers to include a 1st LT. That is my opinion.
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It says a lot about a soldier's professionalism if they do not render that respect even if it's a MAJ aproaching another MAJ then they should properly salute out of respect for one another's rank. If you have ever seen to General Officers in public they do it all the time, some don't but that doesn't mean it's not the proper thing to do
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SSG Darin McNeely
Not generally unless that person is in a position that is above your position yes out of respect the first meeting
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SSG Jamil Spruill
If a MAJ is walking across Fort Bragg and another MAJ is approaching him and they do not show each other and soldiers are watching would it be proper for them to not acknowledge each other when we teach soldiers that regardless of a person wanting you to salute them or not you still render a salute?????
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